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The CES Letter Rebuttal — Part 44

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Part 44: CES Letter Priesthood Restoration Questions [Section B]

By Sarah Allen

 

In today’s post, we’ll be talking about the fact that Joseph updated many of the revelations between the aborted publication attempt of the Book of Commandments in 1833 and the publication of the Doctrine and Covenants in 1835. Jeremy’s main focus, which comprises his questions 3–5, is about Section 27, which I referenced briefly last week. It’s a lot of ground to cover, particularly if I want to try to include question #6 which is the last question in this section. Rather than write a more lengthy introduction, I’m just going to pick up where we left off.

Question/point #3 is a long one, comprising an entire page and a half of the CES Letter. It begins: [Read more…] about The CES Letter Rebuttal — Part 44

The CES Letter Rebuttal — Part 43

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Part 43: CES Letter Priesthood Restoration Questions [Section A]

By Sarah Allen

 

The first two times in my life that I ever felt the Spirit, I was a kid in Primary, too young to even know what the feeling was or what it was trying to teach me…but it was so unusual that I remembered it. The first time I felt it, we were learning the words to “The Spirit of God Like a Fire is Burning.” The second time I felt it, we were learning the words to “Joseph Smith’s First Prayer.”

When I was a few years older, after I had more experience with the Holy Ghost and knew how to recognize it for what it really was, I remembered those first two times I felt His presence and I understood the lessons He was teaching me: that Joseph Smith really did kneel down in that grove of trees, that he really did see God the Father and the Savior, and that the Priesthood really was restored to the Earth. Those were the very first things the Holy Ghost ever taught me, and He has reconfirmed them to me many, many times over the years.

We’ve already discussed the First Vision in this blog series and now, we’re going to discuss the restoration of the Priesthood. Like many of the topics in this Letter, this is one I take seriously. Supposed anachronisms or similar city names are one thing, but the restoration of the Priesthood is something else entirely. It’s literally one of the foundational pillars of my testimony. I’m sure that’s true for many of you, as well. [Read more…] about The CES Letter Rebuttal — Part 43

The CES Letter Rebuttal — Part 42

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Part 42: CES Letter Testimony/Spiritual Witness Questions [Section F]

By Sarah Allen

 

This will be the final post in the section about the Spirit. Next time, we’ll move on to the restoration of the Priesthood and after that, to the Witnesses (which is the largest section in the entire CES Letter), Freemasonry, the Fall/Creation/Adam and Eve, and other issues. We’re in the homestretch, though, and the end of all of this is in sight. It’s been an interesting journey for me and, I hope, for you. I never expected this project to take so much time and effort, and I certainly wasn’t expecting to still be working on it ten months later. It’s been incredibly rewarding, though, and I wanted to thank you all for the support and encouragement you’ve given me as we’ve gone through these issues one by one.

Today, I wanted to open this post with the words of our beloved prophet, President Nelson. In the April 2020 General Conference, he gave a talk entitled “Hear Him,” all about learning how to decipher the words of the Savior given to us through the Spirit. Each of us hears Him in different ways, so we need to learn how the Spirit speaks specifically to us.

In this talk, President Nelson taught: [Read more…] about The CES Letter Rebuttal — Part 42

FAIR Conference Podcast #75 – John Gee, “Lessons on Doing Apologetics”

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Podcast: Download (11.9MB)

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This podcast series features past FAIR Conference presentations. This presentation is from our 2021 conference held in August. If you would like to watch all the presentations from the conference, you can still purchase the video streaming.

John Gee, Lessons on Doing Apologetics

John Gee’s books are for sale in the FAIR bookstore.

John Gee is the William (Bill) Gay Research Professor in the Department of Asian and Near Eastern Languages at Brigham Young University. He has authored more than 150 publications on topics such as ancient scripture, Aramaic, archaeology, Coptic, Egyptian, history, linguistics, Luwian, rhetoric, Sumerian, textual criticism, and published in journals such as British Museum Studies in Ancient Egypt and Sudan, Bulletin of the Egyptological Seminar, Enchoria, Ensign, FARMS Review, Göttinger Miszellen, Issues in Religion and Psychotherapy, Journal of Academic Perspecitves, Journal of the American Research Center in Egypt, Journal of Book of Mormon Studies, Journal of Egyptian History, Journal of the Society for the Study of Egyptian Antiquities, Lingua Aegyptia, Review of Books on the Book of Mormon, Studien zur altägyptischen Kultur, and Interpreter, and by such presses as American University of Cairo Press, Archaeopress, Association Égyptologique Reine Élisabeth, E. J. Brill, Carsten Niebuhr Institute of Near Eastern Studies, Czech Institute of Egyptology, Deseret Book, de Gruyter, Harrassowitz, Institut Français d’Archéologie Orientale, Macmillan, Oxford University Press, Peeters, Praeger, Religious Studies Center, and Society of Biblical Literature. He has published three books and has edited eight books and an international multilingual peer-reviewed professional journal. He served twice as a section chair for the Society of Biblical Literature.

The CES Letter Rebuttal — Part 41

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Part 41: CES Letter Testimony/Spiritual Witness Questions [Section E]

By Sarah Allen

 

There’s a lot of ground to cover today, and it appears the next few questions/concerns are again about discernment. This is ground we already covered during the Prophets section, but we’ll be going over it again in more detail here.

The CES Letter picks up with question/point #6:

  1. Paul H. Dunn: Dunn was a General Authority of the Church for many years. He was a very popular speaker who told powerful, faith-promoting war and baseball stories. Many times Dunn shared these stories in the presence of prophets, apostles, and seventies. Stories such as how God protected him as enemy machine-gun bullets ripped away his clothing, gear, and helmet without ever touching his skin and how he was preserved by the Lord. Members of the Church shared how they strongly felt the Spirit as they listened to Dunn’s testimony and stories.

 Unfortunately, Dunn was later caught lying about his war and baseball stories and was forced to apologize to the members. He became the first General Authority to gain “emeritus” status and was removed from public church life.

It’s ironic that Jeremy is calling Paul Dunn out for inaccuracy and exaggeration when he does the same thing repeatedly throughout this Letter—including in these very paragraphs. Some of Dunn’s stories were exaggerated, yes. Not all of them were, but a fair number certainly were and it was rightfully a scandal when it was exposed. [Read more…] about The CES Letter Rebuttal — Part 41

The CES Letter Rebuttal — Part 40

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Part 40: CES Letter Testimony/Spiritual Witness Questions [Section D]

By Sarah Allen

 

The topic we’re going to cover today is one that I’m passionate about, and that’s personal study: study of the scriptures, study of Church history, study of the prophets, and study of the Gospel. Many if not all of the prophets of the Restoration have encouraged us to do our own studying in addition to the lessons we receive in Sunday School, Seminary, or Institute.

At church the goal is to learn the doctrine. Some history gets thrown in, particularly when we’re talking about the Doctrine and Covenants, but for the most part that isn’t the focus of our lessons. That’s something we’re meant to study on our own time. We’ll skim through the scripture verses we were meant to read that week, and we’ll go over some words of modern prophets that align with those scripture verses, but we don’t really dive in very deeply to most of the topics we cover each year because there are just so many. Many teachers only have time to hit the most important points and skim over the rest. [Read more…] about The CES Letter Rebuttal — Part 40

The CES Letter Rebuttal — Part 39

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Part 39: CES Letter Testimony/Spiritual Witness Questions [Section C]

by Sarah Allen

 

When you look over this section of the CES Letter, one of the most common threads is arrogance. Jeremy talks about it, ironically saying how arrogant it is to deny the spiritual experiences of others while simultaneously denying that anyone’s spiritual experiences mean anything at all. He also makes broad generalizations about the hearts and minds of the members of the Church, and then attacks the arrogance his own straw man superimposed on those hearts and minds.

More than that, though, this section of the Letter is permeated with its own kind of arrogance. Brushing off the valid, physical experiences of millions of people as unreliable and unimportant is arrogant. Twisting the words of Apostles of the Lord into pretzels in order to imply they said something they didn’t is arrogant. Questioning the purpose and methods of a member of the Godhead, then declaring God Himself as being inefficient, takes an astounding amount of arrogance. In fact, I don’t think it’s even possible to have more arrogance than to believe that you know better than God does.

That kind of pride can be corrosive. If unchecked, it erodes your ability to feel the Spirit to the point where you can’t feel it anymore. It warps your mind and leads you to make terrible decisions. And all the while, you feel as though you’re the one who’s in the right. Everyone else needs you to rescue them. That’s the face he puts on the CES Letter, one of trying to save others from the Church. And in this section, Jeremy’s trying to “rescue” you from God’s way of communicating with His children. He’s trying to “save” you from returning home to live with God.

Please stand strong against his urgings. Remember, it’s not the Holy Ghost telling you not to pray and to turn away from God.

[Read more…] about The CES Letter Rebuttal — Part 39

The CES Letter Rebuttal — Part 38

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Part 38: CES Letter Testimony/Spiritual Witness Questions [Section B]

by Sarah Allen

 

Last week, I spoke about the progression of ideas I see in the CES Letter and how dangerous I think this section is. Jeremy Runnells isn’t just targeting other flawed human beings or messy historical events without much documentation this time. He’s not talking about controversial statements or doctrines, either. He’s directly targeting a member of the Godhead and the way in which our Father and Savior speak to us. If he can cast doubt on that, if he can make you think that They don’t speak to us the way we’re taught They do, then the easier it becomes for him to convince you that They don’t exist at all.

I truly believe that’s at the crux of this. There’s a reason why some former members of our church don’t join another church when they leave and instead become atheist or agnostic. Things in our church are often presented as all or nothing. Last week, we went through several scriptures that taught that we can either choose the things of God or the things of Satan. Either our temple covenants are necessary for exaltation or they’re not. Either the Priesthood was restored to the Earth or it wasn’t. Either Joseph Smith knelt in a grove of trees, saw God the Father and the Savior, and later spoke with a resurrected Moroni face to face, or he didn’t. Either the story he told us surrounding the coming forth of the Book of Mormon is true, or he’s a liar. Either the Book of Mormon is a genuine ancient record translated by revelation, or it’s made up. There’s no in-between. Even the Savior Himself told us that if we’re not with Him, we’re against Him.

While that concept isn’t true for our testimonies (it’s normal if we don’t have perfect faith in everything right away, or if we have to build our testimonies brick by brick), it’s true for a lot of things in the Gospel and in the Church. And if Jeremy can make you doubt enough of those very basic, fundamental cornerstones of your faith, eventually, he’ll make you doubt whether God is even real.

But God is real. The Savior is real. The Holy Ghost is real. And the way that They speak to us is through the Spirit. Regardless of whatever doubts Jeremy tries to sow, we are not alone. They did not abandon us to find our own way without Their help. We just have to ask for it.

[Read more…] about The CES Letter Rebuttal — Part 38

The CES Letter Rebuttal — Part 37

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Part 37: CES Letter Testimony/Spiritual Witness Questions [Section A]

by Sarah Allen

 

Entries in this series (this link does not work properly in old Reddit or 3rd-party apps): https://www.reddit.com/r/lds/collection/11be9581-6e2e-4837-9ed4-30f5e37782b2

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While the CES Letter has jumped around a bit in terms of topics, the progression of ideas has been interesting to see. First, it went after the Book of Mormon, the First Vision, and Joseph Smith. Then, it went after Brigham Young and prophets in general. Now, it’s going after the Spirit and personal revelation. It’s directly targeting a member of the Godhead. It’s trying to systematically knock down all of the basic pillars of a testimony so there’ll be nothing left to hold it up by the end. The entire purpose of the Letter is to attack that firm foundation your testimony should be built on so that it can’t continue to stand.

Many of us grew up, or have kids who are growing up, singing “The Wise Man and the Foolish Man” in Primary. It’s based on the parable given by the Savior in Matthew 7:24-27, which teaches us that the wise man builds his house (or testimony) upon a rock, while the foolish man builds his house/testimony upon sand, which will wash away in a storm. The CES Letter works very hard to try to flip the script, saying that only foolish people will base their testimonies on sandy concepts like “feelings” and “revelation” instead of rock-solid concepts like “science” and “common sense.”

But there is nothing foolish about listening to the Spirit, and putting your faith in the knowledge of man rather than the wisdom of God will never lead you in the right direction.

I have to admit, this topic is a little harder to discuss than some of the others have been simply because it’s a more nebulous concept. We aren’t talking about historical facts, figures, and documents this time around. We’re talking about the Spirit, something more amorphous but equally as real as historical documents are. As such, I hope you guys will forgive me if this section is maybe a little clumsy compared to some of the others. Our sources on this section are going to be far more scripture- and talk-oriented rather than scholarly research, too. I’m looking forward to that because they’re the best sources to lean on, anyway.

[Read more…] about The CES Letter Rebuttal — Part 37

Rethinking Revelation and the Human Element in Scripture

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Available in the FAIR Bookstore

by Michael R. Ash

Those who have read any of my writings in the past several decades will know that I’ve been a volunteer for FAIR for more than twenty years. I’m an active Latter-day Saint who accepts prophets as the divinely called and authorized agents of Christ’s church on earth. And, like many other believing members, scholars, and LDS-scientists, I also try to think rationally and logically, and I embrace the general conclusions of secular science and “objective” history.

Faith-Crisis

In the more than forty years that I’ve been reading and writing about LDS scholarly issues (including the twenty years I’ve been volunteering for FAIR), I’ve spent a lot of time analyzing the intellectual reasons people leave the faith. Obviously, there are many reasons that people leave the Church, but I’ve always been interested in the historical and scientific issues that unseat some LDS testimonies. [Read more…] about Rethinking Revelation and the Human Element in Scripture