Criticism of Mormonism/Books/The Changing World of Mormonism/Chapter 21

FAIR Answers—back to home page

Response to claims made in "Chapter 21: The Hereafter"

Chapter 20

A FAIR Analysis of: Criticism of Mormonism/Books, a work by author: Jerald and Sandra Tanner

Chapter 22

Claim Evaluation

The Changing World of Mormonism

Response to claims made in The Changing World of Mormonism, "Chapter 21: The Hereafter"

Jump to details:

• Response to claim: 506 - LDS leaders teach the "endless punishement" won't last forever
• Response to claim: 506 - Joseph Smith's later teachings regarding endless punishment contradict the Book of Mormon
• Response to claim: 507 - Brigham Young taught that there would be no women in hell
• Response to claim: 507 - LDS leaders teach that "very few" will become "sons of perdition"
• Response to claim: 508 - The idea of "spirit prison" as an opportunity for the dead to be taught and receive the gospel contradicts the Book of Mormon
• Response to claim: 510 - The concept of three degrees of glory is not consistent with the Book of Mormon

Response to claim: 506 - LDS leaders teach the "endless punishement" won't last forever

The author(s) of The Changing World of Mormonism make(s) the following claim:

LDS leaders teach the "endless punishement" won't last forever.

Author's sources:

FAIR's Response

Fact checking results: This claim is based upon correct information - The author is providing knowledge concerning some particular fact, subject, or event

This is correct, since Latter-day Saints consider "endless" one of the names of God, and that "endless punishment" is therefore "God's punishment."

Question: What is the nature of "endless" or "eternal" punishment?

The Book of Mormon seems to indicate that the suffering of the wicked will go on forever without end

The Lord often uses the phrases "endless punishment," "endless torment," and "eternal damnation" to describe the type of punishment that will be administered to the wicked. It is natural to assume, given our understanding of the words "endless" and "eternal," to believe that punishment would continue forever. In fact, the Book of Mormon states:

1 Nephi 9꞉16

And assuredly, as the Lord liveth, for the Lord God hath spoken it, and it is his eternal word, which cannot pass away, that they who are righteous shall be righteous still, and they who are filthy shall be filthy still; wherefore, they who are filthy are the devil and his angels; and they shall go away into everlasting fire, prepared for them; and their torment is as a lake of fire and brimstone, whose flame ascendeth up forever and ever and has no end.

This certainly initially appears to support the idea that the Book of Mormon indicates that the suffering of the wicked will go on forever without end. In fact, Alma's son Corianton was concerned about the nature of this punishment.

Alma 42꞉1

And now, my son, I perceive there is somewhat more which doth worry your mind, which ye cannot understand—which is concerning the justice of God in the punishment of the sinner; for ye do try to suppose that it is injustice that the sinner should be consigned to a state of misery.

The Lord clarified the meaning of these terms to Joseph Smith in a revelation given in March, 1830

Alma's response to his son emphasized the need to repent in order to satisfy justice, but he did not elaborate on the exact nature of the punishment that would be administered if one did not repent. The natural concern is the idea that people would be "consigned to suffer throughout all eternity for what was done during the few years of mortality." Fortunately, the Lord clarified the meaning of these terms to Joseph Smith in a revelation given in March, 1830.

D&C 19꞉4-12 states:

And surely every man must repent or suffer, for I, God, am endless.

Wherefore, I revoke not the judgments which I shall pass, but woes shall go forth, weeping, wailing and gnashing of teeth, yea, to those who are found on my left hand.

Nevertheless, it is not written that there shall be no end to this torment, but it is written endless torment.

Again, it is written eternal damnation; wherefore it is more express than other scriptures, that it might work upon the hearts of the children of men, altogether for my name’s glory.

Wherefore, I will explain unto you this mystery, for it is meet unto you to know even as mine apostles.

I speak unto you that are chosen in this thing, even as one, that you may enter into my rest.

For, behold, the mystery of godliness, how great is it! For, behold, I am endless, and the punishment which is given from my hand is endless punishment, for Endless is my name. Wherefore—

Eternal punishment is God’s punishment.

Endless punishment is God’s punishment.

The Book of Mormon does provide indications that the use of the words "endless" and "eternal" indicate the nature of the punishment rather than its duration, thus contradicting the claims made by the critics. The Lord, through modern revelation, provided clarification on the meaning of the terms "endless" and "eternal" when used to describe punishment. Thus, Latter-day Saints understand "endless punishment" and "eternal punishment" to mean "God's punishment," since "endless" and "eternal" are two of God's names. Likewise, the term "eternal life" can be interpreted to mean "God's life" in the same manner.

Question: What is the meaning of "eternal" life?

Given the "eternal" punishment represents "God's punishment," it stands to reason the "eternal" life refers to "God's life"

Arthur R. Bassett states in the February 1978 Ensign:

The significant relationship between knowing God and eternal life is clarified by the Lord’s explanation to Joseph in 1830 that “Endless” is another name properly applied to Him, and, consequently, that Eternal punishment, or Endless punishment, is God’s punishment. (See D&C 19:10–12.) It seems to follow then that eternal life is God’s life. Therefore, the Prophet’s statement can be taken to mean, in part, that eternal life, being God’s life, is understood only as one comes to know God and Christ. Knowing the Master ultimately seems to mean becoming like the Master.

Response to claim: 506 - Joseph Smith's later teachings regarding endless punishment contradict the Book of Mormon

The author(s) of The Changing World of Mormonism make(s) the following claim:

Joseph Smith's later teachings regarding endless punishment contradict the Book of Mormon.

Author's sources:

• Doctrine and Covenants 19:6
• Doctrines of Salvation, vol. 2, p.160
• Alma 42꞉16

FAIR's Response

Fact checking results: The author has stated erroneous information or misinterpreted their sources

The authors are incorrect. The Book of Mormon supports the Latter-day Saint view of "endless" punishment.

Question: Does the Book of Mormon support the idea that "eternal" or "endless" punishment can be temporary?

In the Book of Mormon, Alma's "eternal torment" only lasted three days

The Book of Mormon does indeed provide some indication of the true nature of "eternal" and "endless" punishment. Consider Alma's description of his conversion experience during the three days that he was incapacitated after seeing an angel. Alma says,

I was racked with eternal torment, for my soul was harrowed up to the greatest degree and racked with all my sins. (Alma 36꞉12) (emphasis added)

Alma's "eternal torment" lasted only three days, which implies that he was describing the nature of his torment rather than its duration. Similarly, in Mosiah 27꞉28 Alma says

Alma was also removed from a state of "everlasting burning"

Nevertheless, after wading through much tribulation, repenting nigh unto death, the Lord in mercy hath seen fit to snatch me out of an everlasting burning, and I am born of God.

The term "everlasting burning" obviously refers to a state of torment rather than a duration.

In the Book of Mormon, we find:

O the greatness of the mercy of our God, the Holy One of Israel! For he delivereth his saints from that awful monster the devil, and death, and hell, and that lake of fire and brimstone, which is endless torment. 2 Nephi 9꞉19 (emphasis added)

The statements by Alma and Nephi effectively negate the criticism that the Book of Mormon contradicts Joseph Smith's teachings on the nature of "endless" and "eternal" punishment.

Response to claim: 507 - Brigham Young taught that there would be no women in hell

The author(s) of The Changing World of Mormonism make(s) the following claim:

Brigham Young taught that there would be no women in hell.

Author's sources:

1. Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses 8:222.

FAIR's Response

Fact checking results: This claim is based upon correct information - The author is providing knowledge concerning some particular fact, subject, or event

Brigham apparently believed this, but it is not doctrine.

Sons of Perdition

• Question: What must one do in order to become a son of perdition?
• Question: Will sons of perdition be resurrected?
• Question: Will the sons of perdition be given another chance to achieve celestial glory?
• Question: Are there women who will be among the sons of perdition?

Response to claim: 507 - LDS leaders teach that "very few" will become "sons of perdition"

The author(s) of The Changing World of Mormonism make(s) the following claim:

LDS leaders teach that "very few" will become "sons of perdition."

Author's sources:

1. Joseph Smith—Seeker After Truth, pp.177-78

FAIR's Response

Fact checking results: This claim is based upon correct information - The author is providing knowledge concerning some particular fact, subject, or event

This is correct.

Sons of Perdition

• Question: What must one do in order to become a son of perdition?
• Question: Will sons of perdition be resurrected?
• Question: Will the sons of perdition be given another chance to achieve celestial glory?
• Question: Are there women who will be among the sons of perdition?

Response to claim: 508 - The idea of "spirit prison" as an opportunity for the dead to be taught and receive the gospel contradicts the Book of Mormon

The author(s) of The Changing World of Mormonism make(s) the following claim:

The idea of "spirit prison" as an opportunity for the dead to be taught and receive the gospel contradicts the Book of Mormon.

Author's sources:

• Doctrines of Salvation 2:183
• Doctrines of Salvation 3:60
• Heber C. Kimball, Journal of Discourses 4:223.
• Alma 34꞉32-35

FAIR's Response

Fact checking results: The author has stated erroneous information or misinterpreted their sources

The Book of Mormon is addressed to those who have heard the gospel in this life; the doctrine of post-mortal evangelization is a different matter.

Response to claim: 510 - The concept of three degrees of glory is not consistent with the Book of Mormon

The author(s) of The Changing World of Mormonism make(s) the following claim:

The concept of three degrees of glory is not consistent with the Book of Mormon.

Author's sources:

• 1 Nephi 15꞉35
• Orson Pratt, Journal of Discourses 20:70.

FAIR's Response

Fact checking results: The author has stated erroneous information or misinterpreted their sources

The Book of Mormon is targeted at the fundamentals of the gospel; the doctrine of the degrees of glory is biblical (1 Corinthians 15꞉40-42, 2 Corinthians 12:2) and complementary to it.

Question: How can the Book of Mormon contain the "fulness of the Gospel" if it does not speak of ordinances such as baptism for the dead or celestial marriage?

The Book of Mormon does not contain detailed descriptions of many religious topics and ordinances, such as eternal marriage or baptism for the dead

Is it possible that the Book of Mormon cannot contain "the fulness of the gospel" because it doesn't teach certain unique LDS doctrines, such as baptism for the dead, the Word of Wisdom, the three degrees of glory, celestial marriage, vicarious work for the dead, and the corporeal nature of God the Father?

There are many religious topics and doctrines which The Book of Mormon does not discuss in detail (e.g., the premortal existence—see Alma 13), and some which are not even mentioned (e.g., the ordinance of baptism for the dead).

This is unsurprising, since the Book of Mormon's goal is to teach the "fulness of the gospel"—the doctrine of Christ.

Harold B. Lee: "our scoffers say, 'How can you say that the Book of Mormon has the fulness of the gospel when it doesn't speak of baptism for the dead?'"

Of this criticism, Harold B. Lee said:

Now, our scoffers say, "How can you say that the Book of Mormon has the fulness of the gospel when it doesn't speak of baptism for the dead?" Some of you may have asked that question.

What is the gospel as it is defined? Let me give you how the Lord defines the gospel, in these words: "And verily, verily, I say unto you, he that receiveth my gospel receiveth me; and he that receiveth not my gospel receiveth not me. And this is my gospel—repentance and baptism by water, and then cometh the baptism of fire and the Holy Ghost, even the Comforter, which showeth all things, and teacheth the peaceable things of the kingdom." (D&C 39꞉5-6.)

Wherever you have a restoration of the gospel, where those fundamental ordinances and the power of the Holy Ghost are among men, there you have the power by which the Lord can reveal all things that pertain to the kingdom in detail, don't you see, including baptism for the dead, which He has done in our day. That is what the Prophet Joseph Smith meant when he was questioned, "How does your church differ from all the other churches?" and his answer was simple, "We are different from all the other churches because we have the Holy Ghost." (See History of the Church 4:42.) Therein we have the teachings of the fulness of those essentials in the Book of Mormon upon the foundations of which the kingdom of God is established.

BYU professor Noel Reynolds wrote:

The gospel of Jesus Christ is not synonymous with the plan of salvation (or plan of redemption), but is a key part thereof. Brigham Young stated that the 'Gospel of the Son of God that has been revealed is a plan or system of laws and ordinances, by strict obedience to which the people who inhabit this earth are assured that they may return again into the presence of the Father and the Son.' While the plan of salvation is what God and Christ have done for mortals in the creation, the fall, the atonement, the final judgment, and the salvation of the world, the gospel contains the instructions--the laws and ordinances--that enable human beings to make the atonement effective in their lives and thereby gain salvation.

Notes