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Difference between revisions of "Criticism of Mormonism/Books/One Nation Under Gods/Chapter 15"
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====331, 591n2 (PB)==== | ====331, 591n2 (PB)==== | ||
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*Doesn't the Bible condemn revenge? | *Doesn't the Bible condemn revenge? | ||
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*[[Oath of vengeance]] | *[[Oath of vengeance]] | ||
* The oath asked ''God'' to take vengeance for wicked acts—this is hardly unbiblical, since the Bible repeatedly promises that ''he'' will "avenge the blood of his servants" ({{b||Deuteronomy|32|43}}; see also {{b||Psalms|58|10}}, {{b||Psalms|94||}}, {{b||Isaiah|1|24}}, {{b||Jeremiah|46|10}}, {{b||Luke|18|17-18}}, {{b||Revelation|6|10}}). The Bible also has numerous examples of the righteous pleading for or declaring God's vengeance upon their enemies (e.g., {{b|1|Samuel|24|12}}, {{b||Isaiah|35|4}}, {{b||Jeremiah|11|20}}, {{b||Jeremiah|50|15}}, {{b||Jeremiah|15||}}, {{b||Ezekiel|25||}}, {{b|2|Thessalonians|1|8}}). | * The oath asked ''God'' to take vengeance for wicked acts—this is hardly unbiblical, since the Bible repeatedly promises that ''he'' will "avenge the blood of his servants" ({{b||Deuteronomy|32|43}}; see also {{b||Psalms|58|10}}, {{b||Psalms|94||}}, {{b||Isaiah|1|24}}, {{b||Jeremiah|46|10}}, {{b||Luke|18|17-18}}, {{b||Revelation|6|10}}). The Bible also has numerous examples of the righteous pleading for or declaring God's vengeance upon their enemies (e.g., {{b|1|Samuel|24|12}}, {{b||Isaiah|35|4}}, {{b||Jeremiah|11|20}}, {{b||Jeremiah|50|15}}, {{b||Jeremiah|15||}}, {{b||Ezekiel|25||}}, {{b|2|Thessalonians|1|8}}). | ||
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====334, 592n10==== | ====334, 592n10==== | ||
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+ | *Where Latter-day Saints who served in positions in the U.S. government hindered by having taken an "oath of vengeance?" | ||
+ | *{{AuthorQuote|"One can only wonder how these persons have reconciled their sacred oath with their pledge of allegiance to America."}} | ||
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* [[Oath of vengeance]] | * [[Oath of vengeance]] | ||
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====335-336==== | ====335-336==== | ||
− | ||" | + | || |
+ | *Did the "oath of vengeance" require the Latter-day Saints instruct their descendants to take vengeance upon the U.S. government? | ||
+ | *{{AuthorQuote|"Exactly how many of today's Saints continue to harbor within their hearts this vow to take vengeance on the U.S. remains unclear, since it would be a secret not to be shared with outsiders. At the very least it may mean that when push comes to shove, every Mormon acquainted with the oath and taught to follow it will choose loyalty to the church (whatever form that may take) over loyalty to the United States."}} | ||
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*[[../../Absurd claims|Absurd claims]] | *[[../../Absurd claims|Absurd claims]] | ||
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====336==== | ====336==== | ||
− | ||LDS church authorities believe that "non-Mormons are unfit to rule | + | || |
+ | *Do LDS church authorities believe that "non-Mormons are unfit to rule" and that Latter-day Saints are the only ones fit to rule the world? | ||
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* This claim is contradicted by LDS scripture: {{s||DC|98|10-11}}, {{s||DC|101|80}}, {{s||DC|134|1-12}}. | * This claim is contradicted by LDS scripture: {{s||DC|98|10-11}}, {{s||DC|101|80}}, {{s||DC|134|1-12}}. | ||
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====336, 593n17==== | ====336, 593n17==== | ||
− | ||Church president Joseph F. Smith " | + | || |
+ | *Did Church president Joseph F. Smith defend his "illegal cohabitation with five wives" during Senate testimony. | ||
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* President Smith was quite frank that to cohabitate violated the "rule" of the Church and the "law of the land," but refused to say that doing so violated the "law of the Church" (p. 128-129) He then explained: | * President Smith was quite frank that to cohabitate violated the "rule" of the Church and the "law of the land," but refused to say that doing so violated the "law of the Church" (p. 128-129) He then explained: | ||
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====337, 593n20==== | ====337, 593n20==== | ||
− | ||Joseph F. Smith | + | || |
+ | *Did Joseph F. Smith authorize polygamous marriages in Mexico and request that the records stay there so that they wouldn't be found during a search by U.S. officials? | ||
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* U.S. law does not apply to Mexico. Federal marshals have no jurisdiction over events which happened abroad. | * U.S. law does not apply to Mexico. Federal marshals have no jurisdiction over events which happened abroad. | ||
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====339, 593n32==== | ====339, 593n32==== | ||
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+ | *Did Joseph F. Smith admit that he had broken the laws of the land and the laws of God? | ||
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*{{InternalContradiction|The author has already cited material ([[One_Nation_Under_Gods/Index/Chapter_15#336.2C_593n17|p. 336]]) more than 200 pages earlier in the testimony that had Pres. Smith admitting that by cohabitation he violated the "law of the land" and the "rule of the Church."}} | *{{InternalContradiction|The author has already cited material ([[One_Nation_Under_Gods/Index/Chapter_15#336.2C_593n17|p. 336]]) more than 200 pages earlier in the testimony that had Pres. Smith admitting that by cohabitation he violated the "law of the land" and the "rule of the Church."}} | ||
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====340, 594n42==== | ====340, 594n42==== | ||
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+ | *Were many polygamous marriages back-dated in church records so that it would look like they were performed before the Manifesto was issued? | ||
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* Note that this claims from the excommunication hearing of former apostle Matthias Cowley. | * Note that this claims from the excommunication hearing of former apostle Matthias Cowley. | ||
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====341, 594n48-50==== | ====341, 594n48-50==== | ||
− | ||Reed Smoot | + | || |
+ | *Did Reed Smoot lie that he had never heard a discussion of plural marriage in his meetings with the apostles and that he had never "advised the promulgation of the practice of polygamy?" | ||
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* "More than one student has suggested that the [Smoot hearings] constituted the most searching, and perhaps bigoted, congressional investigation of any religious body in American history."{{ref|hardy.252.253}} | * "More than one student has suggested that the [Smoot hearings] constituted the most searching, and perhaps bigoted, congressional investigation of any religious body in American history."{{ref|hardy.252.253}} | ||
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====342, 594n53==== | ====342, 594n53==== | ||
− | ||Joseph F. Smith " | + | || |
+ | *Did Joseph F. Smith face a "power struggle" within in the church hierarchy as a result of different opinions on polygamy? | ||
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* {{Offsite|http://www.fairlds.org/Misc/Polygamy_Prophets_and_Prevarication.html#head31|Joseph F. Smith's administration}} | * {{Offsite|http://www.fairlds.org/Misc/Polygamy_Prophets_and_Prevarication.html#head31|Joseph F. Smith's administration}} | ||
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====343, 594n54==== | ====343, 594n54==== | ||
− | ||Joseph F. Smith | + | || |
+ | *What was the "Second Manifesto" issued by Joseph F. Smith? | ||
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* {{Offsite|http://www.fairlds.org/Misc/Polygamy_Prophets_and_Prevarication.html#head31|Joseph F. Smith's administration}} | * {{Offsite|http://www.fairlds.org/Misc/Polygamy_Prophets_and_Prevarication.html#head31|Joseph F. Smith's administration}} | ||
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====351, n91==== | ====351, n91==== | ||
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+ | *Does the Church teach the the current practice of monogamy is only temporary and that polygamy will be reinstated when Christ returns? | ||
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*{{FalseStatement}}: The Church has no position on whether polygamy will be reinstated. Some, like Elder McConkie believed that it would. Others believe not. In any case, ''Mormon Doctrine'' is not an official publication of the Church. | *{{FalseStatement}}: The Church has no position on whether polygamy will be reinstated. Some, like Elder McConkie believed that it would. Others believe not. In any case, ''Mormon Doctrine'' is not an official publication of the Church. | ||
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====353==== | ====353==== | ||
− | ||" | + | || |
+ | *Do Latter-day Saints have "underlying white supremacist beliefs?" | ||
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*The author is claiming that the Church is ''white supremacist?'' | *The author is claiming that the Church is ''white supremacist?'' |
Revision as of 19:50, 15 January 2009
Claims made in "Chapter 14: The Politics of Compromise" | A FAIR Analysis of: Criticism of Mormonism/Books A work by author: Richard Abanes
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Claims made in "Chapter 16: Mormon Racism: Black Is Not Beautiful" |
Claims made in "Chapter 15: Making the Transition"
Exactly how many of today's Saints continue to harbor within their hearts this vow to take vengeance on the U.S. remains unclear, since it would be a secret not to be shared with outsiders. At the very least it may mean that when push comes to shove, every Mormon acquainted with the oath and taught to follow it will choose loyalty to the church (whatever form that may take) over loyalty to the United States.
—One Nation Under Gods, p. 335-336
Page | Claim | Response | Author's sources |
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331, 591n2 (PB) |
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332 |
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334 |
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334, 592n10 |
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335 |
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335-336 |
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336 |
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336, 593n17 |
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337, 593n20 |
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339, 593n32 |
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340, 594n42 |
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341, 594n48-50 |
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342, 594n53 |
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343, 594n54 |
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351, n91 |
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353 |
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Endnotes
- [note] B. Carmon Hardy, Solemn Covenant: The Mormon Polygamous Passage (Urbana and Chicago: University of Illinois Press, 1992), 252–253.
- [note] "Polygamy: Questions and Answers With the Los Angeles Times," (31 May 2006) off-site (last accessed 15 January 2009).
Further reading
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{{To learn more box:responses to: 8: The Mormon Proposition}} | To learn more box:responses to: 8: The Mormon Proposition | edit |
{{To learn more box:''Under the Banner of Heaven''}} | To learn more about responses to: Under the Banner of Heaven | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Robert Price}} | To learn more about responses to: Robert Price | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Ankerberg and Weldon}} | To learn more about responses to: Ankerberg and Weldon | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Ashamed of Joseph}} | To learn more about responses to: Ashamed of Joseph | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Beckwith and Moser}} | To learn more about responses to: Beckwith and Moser | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Beckwith and Parrish}} | To learn more about responses to: Beckwith and Parrish | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Benjamin Park}} | To learn more about responses to: Benjamin Park | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Bible versus Joseph Smith}} | To learn more about responses to: Bible versus Joseph Smith | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Bible versus Book of Mormon}} | To learn more about responses to: Bible versus Book of Mormon | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: ''Big Love''}} | To learn more about responses to: Big Love | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Brett Metcalfe}} | To learn more about responses to: Brett Metcalfe | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Bill Maher}} | To learn more about responses to: Bill Maher | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Bruce H. Porter}} | To learn more about responses to: Bruce H. Porter | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Carol Wang Shutter}} | To learn more about responses to: Carol Wang Shutter | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: CES Letter}} | To learn more about responses to: CES Letter | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Charles Larson}} | To learn more about responses to: Charles Larson | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Christopher Nemelka}} | To learn more about responses to: Christopher Nemelka | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Colby Townshed}} | To learn more about responses to: Colby Townshed | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Contender Ministries}} | To learn more about responses to: Contender Ministries | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Crane and Crane}} | To learn more about responses to: Crane and Crane | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: D. Michael Quinn}} | To learn more about responses to: D. Michael Quinn | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Dan Vogel}} | To learn more about responses to: Dan Vogel | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: David John Buerger}} | To learn more about responses to: David John Buerger | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: David Persuitte}} | To learn more about responses to: David Persuitte | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Denver Snuffer}} | To learn more about responses to: Denver Snuffer | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Dick Bauer}} | To learn more about responses to: Dick Bauer | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Duwayne R Anderson}} | To learn more about responses to: Duwayne R Anderson | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Earl Wunderli}} | To learn more about responses to: Earl Wunderli | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Ed Decker}} | To learn more about responses to: Ed Decker | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Erikson and Giesler}} | To learn more about responses to: Erikson and Giesler | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Ernest Taves}} | To learn more about responses to: Ernest Taves | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Fawn Brodie}} | To learn more about responses to: Fawn Brodie | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: George D Smith}} | To learn more about responses to: George D Smith | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Grant Palmer}} | To learn more about responses to: Grant Palmer | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Hank Hanegraaff}} | To learn more about responses to: Hank Hanegraaff | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Hurlbut-Howe}} | To learn more about responses to: Hurlbut-Howe | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: James Brooke}} | To learn more about responses to: James Brooke | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: James Spencer}} | To learn more about responses to: James Spencer | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: James White}} | To learn more about responses to: James White | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Jerald and Sandra Tanner}} | To learn more about responses to: Jerald and Sandra Tanner | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Jesus Christ-Joseph Smith or Search for the Truth DVD}} | To learn more about responses to: Jesus Christ-Joseph Smith or Search for the Truth DVD | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: John Dehlin}} | To learn more about responses to: John Dehlin | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Jonathan Neville}} | To learn more about responses to: Jonathan Neville | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Kurt Van Gorden}} | To learn more about responses to: Kurt Van Gorden | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Laura King Newell and Valeen Tippetts Avery}} | To learn more about responses to: Laura King Newell and Valeen Tippetts Avery | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Loftes Tryk aka Lofte Payne}} | To learn more about responses to: Loftes Tryk aka Lofte Payne | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Luke WIlson}} | To learn more about responses to: Luke WIlson | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Marquardt and Walters}} | To learn more about responses to: Marquardt and Walters | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Martha Beck}} | To learn more about responses to: Martha Beck | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Mcgregor Ministries}} | To learn more about responses to: Mcgregor Ministries | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: McKeever and Johnson}} | To learn more about responses to: McKeever and Johnson | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: New Approaches}} | To learn more about responses to: New Approaches to the Book of Mormon | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Richard Abanes}} | To learn more about responses to: Richard Abanes | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Richard Van Wagoner}} | To learn more about responses to: Richard Van Wagoner | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Richard and Joan Ostling}} | To learn more about responses to: Richard and Joan Ostling | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Rick Grunger}} | To learn more about responses to: Rick Grunger | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Robert Ritner}} | To learn more about responses to: Robert Ritner | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Rod Meldrum}} | To learn more about responses to: Rod Meldrum | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Roger I Anderson}} | To learn more about responses to: Roger I Anderson | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Ronald V. Huggins}} | To learn more about responses to: Ronald V. Huggins | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Sally Denton}} | To learn more about responses to: Sally Denton | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Simon Southerton}} | To learn more about responses to: Simon Southerton | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Thomas Murphy}} | To learn more about responses to: Thomas Murphy | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Todd Compton}} | To learn more about responses to: Todd Compton | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Vernal Holley}} | To learn more about responses to: Vernal Holley | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Walter Martin}} | To learn more about responses to: Walter Martin | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Wesley Walters}} | To learn more about responses to: Wesley Walters | edit |
{{To learn more box:responses to: Will Bagley}} | To learn more about responses to: Will Bagley | edit |