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Difference between revisions of "Mormonism and Wikipedia/Golden plates/Receiving"
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The next annual visit on September 22, 1827 would be, Smith told associates, his last chance to receive the plates. | The next annual visit on September 22, 1827 would be, Smith told associates, his last chance to receive the plates. | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | *{{Harvtxt|Knight|1833|p=3}}. | + | #*{{Harvtxt|Knight|1833|p=3}}. |
|response= | |response= | ||
*{{WikipediaCITE}}According to Joseph Knight, Joseph told him that he might obtain the plates on the next annual visit and that if not "he never would have them." The wiki editor has reworded this as "Smith told associates." | *{{WikipediaCITE}}According to Joseph Knight, Joseph told him that he might obtain the plates on the next annual visit and that if not "he never would have them." The wiki editor has reworded this as "Smith told associates." | ||
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According to Brigham Young, as the scheduled final date to obtain the plates approached, several Palmyra residents expressed concern "that they were going to lose that treasure" and sent for a skilled [[necromancer]] from 60 miles (96 km) away, encouraging him to make three separate trips to Palmyra to find the plates. | According to Brigham Young, as the scheduled final date to obtain the plates approached, several Palmyra residents expressed concern "that they were going to lose that treasure" and sent for a skilled [[necromancer]] from 60 miles (96 km) away, encouraging him to make three separate trips to Palmyra to find the plates. | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | *{{Harvtxt|Young|1855|p=180}}. | + | #*{{Harvtxt|Young|1855|p=180}}. |
|response= | |response= | ||
*{{WikipediaCorrect}} | *{{WikipediaCorrect}} | ||
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During one of these trips, the unnamed necromancer is said to have discovered the location, but was unable to determine the value of the plates. | During one of these trips, the unnamed necromancer is said to have discovered the location, but was unable to determine the value of the plates. | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | *{{Harvtxt|Young|1855|pp=180–81}}. | + | #*{{Harvtxt|Young|1855|pp=180–81}}. |
|response= | |response= | ||
*{{WikipediaCorrect}} | *{{WikipediaCorrect}} | ||
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A few days prior to the September 22, 1827 visit to the hill, Smith's loyal treasure-hunting friends Josiah Stowell and [[Joseph Knight, Sr.]] traveled to Palmyra, in part, to be there during Smith's scheduled visit to the hill. | A few days prior to the September 22, 1827 visit to the hill, Smith's loyal treasure-hunting friends Josiah Stowell and [[Joseph Knight, Sr.]] traveled to Palmyra, in part, to be there during Smith's scheduled visit to the hill. | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | *{{Harvtxt|Knight|1833|p=3}} (Saying Knight went to Rochester on business, and then passed back through Palmyra so that he could be there on September 22); {{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|p=99}} (Smith's mother, stating Knight and Stowell arrived there September 20, 1827 to inquire on business matters, but stayed at the Smith home until September 22). | + | #*{{Harvtxt|Knight|1833|p=3}} (Saying Knight went to Rochester on business, and then passed back through Palmyra so that he could be there on September 22); {{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|p=99}} (Smith's mother, stating Knight and Stowell arrived there September 20, 1827 to inquire on business matters, but stayed at the Smith home until September 22). |
|response= | |response= | ||
*{{WikipediaCITE|editor=COgden|wikipedialink=http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Golden_plates&diff=127229835&oldid=127225564}} The cited sources do not refer to Knight and Stowell as Joseph's "loyal treasure-hunting friends." Per Wikipedia guidelines, a statement such as this could only be used if it were an opinion expressed by a secondary source, and if it were clearly identified as an author's opinion. None of that has occurred in this case. | *{{WikipediaCITE|editor=COgden|wikipedialink=http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Golden_plates&diff=127229835&oldid=127225564}} The cited sources do not refer to Knight and Stowell as Joseph's "loyal treasure-hunting friends." Per Wikipedia guidelines, a statement such as this could only be used if it were an opinion expressed by a secondary source, and if it were clearly identified as an author's opinion. None of that has occurred in this case. | ||
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Another of Smith's former treasure-hunting associates, Samuel T. Lawrence, was also apparently aware of the approaching date to obtain the plates, and Smith was concerned he might cause trouble. | Another of Smith's former treasure-hunting associates, Samuel T. Lawrence, was also apparently aware of the approaching date to obtain the plates, and Smith was concerned he might cause trouble. | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | *{{Harvtxt|Knight|1833|p=3}} (saying Lawrence was a seer, had been to the hill, and knew what was there). | + | #*{{Harvtxt|Knight|1833|p=3}} (saying Lawrence was a seer, had been to the hill, and knew what was there). |
|response= | |response= | ||
*{{WikipediaCITE}}The cited source says nothing about Samuel Lawrence being "[a]nother of Smith's former treasure-hunting associates." According to Joseph Knight's account, this is everything that he has to say about Samuel Lawrence: | *{{WikipediaCITE}}The cited source says nothing about Samuel Lawrence being "[a]nother of Smith's former treasure-hunting associates." According to Joseph Knight's account, this is everything that he has to say about Samuel Lawrence: | ||
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Therefore, on the eve of September 22, 1827, the scheduled date for retrieving the plates, Smith dispatched his father to spy on Lawrence's house until dark. If Lawrence attempted to leave, the elder Joseph was to tell him that his son would "thrash the stumps with him" if he found him at the hill. | Therefore, on the eve of September 22, 1827, the scheduled date for retrieving the plates, Smith dispatched his father to spy on Lawrence's house until dark. If Lawrence attempted to leave, the elder Joseph was to tell him that his son would "thrash the stumps with him" if he found him at the hill. | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | *{{Harvtxt|Knight|1833|p=3}} | + | #*{{Harvtxt|Knight|1833|p=3}} |
|response= | |response= | ||
*{{WikipediaCorrect}} | *{{WikipediaCorrect}} | ||
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Late at night, Smith took a horse and carriage to the hill [[Cumorah]] with his wife Emma. | Late at night, Smith took a horse and carriage to the hill [[Cumorah]] with his wife Emma. | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | *{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|p=100}}; {{Harvtxt|Salisbury|1895|p=15}} (Emma "didn't see the records, but she went with him"). | + | #*{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|p=100}}; {{Harvtxt|Salisbury|1895|p=15}} (Emma "didn't see the records, but she went with him"). |
|response= | |response= | ||
*It should be noted that the hill was not named "Cumorah" until much later. | *It should be noted that the hill was not named "Cumorah" until much later. | ||
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While Emma stayed behind kneeling in prayer, | While Emma stayed behind kneeling in prayer, | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | *{{Harvtxt|Harris|1853|p=164}}. | + | #*{{Harvtxt|Harris|1853|p=164}}. |
|response= | |response= | ||
*{{WikipediaCorrect}} | *{{WikipediaCorrect}} | ||
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Joseph walked to what he said was the site of the Golden Plates. Some time in the early morning hours, he said he retrieved the plates and hid them in a hollow log on or near Cumorah. | Joseph walked to what he said was the site of the Golden Plates. Some time in the early morning hours, he said he retrieved the plates and hid them in a hollow log on or near Cumorah. | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | *{{Harvtxt|Chase|1833|p=246}}; {{Harvtxt|Smith|1850|p=104}} (Smith had cut away the bark of a decaying log, placed the plates inside, then covered the log with debris); {{Harvtxt|Harris|1859|p=165}}; {{Harvtxt|Salisbury|1895|p=15}} (saying Smith "brought them part way home and hid them in a hollow log"). | + | #*{{Harvtxt|Chase|1833|p=246}}; {{Harvtxt|Smith|1850|p=104}} (Smith had cut away the bark of a decaying log, placed the plates inside, then covered the log with debris); {{Harvtxt|Harris|1859|p=165}}; {{Harvtxt|Salisbury|1895|p=15}} (saying Smith "brought them part way home and hid them in a hollow log"). |
|response= | |response= | ||
*{{WikipediaCorrect}} | *{{WikipediaCorrect}} | ||
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At the same time, Joseph said he received a pair of large spectacles he called the "[[Urim and Thummim (Latter Day Saints)|Urim and Thummim]]" or "Interpreters", with lenses consisting of two [[Seer stones and the Latter Day Saint movement|seer stones]], which he showed [[Lucy Mack Smith|his mother]] when he returned in the morning. | At the same time, Joseph said he received a pair of large spectacles he called the "[[Urim and Thummim (Latter Day Saints)|Urim and Thummim]]" or "Interpreters", with lenses consisting of two [[Seer stones and the Latter Day Saint movement|seer stones]], which he showed [[Lucy Mack Smith|his mother]] when he returned in the morning. | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | *{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|p=101}}. Smith's friend Joseph Knight said Smith was even more fascinated by the Interpreters than the plates {{Harv|Knight|1833|p=3}}. | + | #*{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|p=101}}. Smith's friend Joseph Knight said Smith was even more fascinated by the Interpreters than the plates {{Harv|Knight|1833|p=3}}. |
|response= | |response= | ||
*{{WikipediaCorrect}} Note that, at least in this instance, Knight is not referred to as Joseph's "loyal treasure seeking" friend. | *{{WikipediaCorrect}} Note that, at least in this instance, Knight is not referred to as Joseph's "loyal treasure seeking" friend. | ||
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Over the next few days, Smith took a well-digging job in nearby [[Macedon (town), New York|Macedon]] to earn enough money to buy a solid lockable chest in which to put the plates. | Over the next few days, Smith took a well-digging job in nearby [[Macedon (town), New York|Macedon]] to earn enough money to buy a solid lockable chest in which to put the plates. | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | *{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|p=101}}. | + | #*{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|p=101}}. |
|response= | |response= | ||
*{{WikipediaCorrect}} | *{{WikipediaCorrect}} | ||
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By then, however, some of Smith's treasure-seeking company had heard that Smith said he had been successful in obtaining the plates, and they wanted what they believed was their share of the profits from what they viewed as part of a joint venture in treasure hunting. | By then, however, some of Smith's treasure-seeking company had heard that Smith said he had been successful in obtaining the plates, and they wanted what they believed was their share of the profits from what they viewed as part of a joint venture in treasure hunting. | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | *{{Harvtxt|Harris|1859|p=167}}. | + | #*{{Harvtxt|Harris|1859|p=167}}. |
|response= | |response= | ||
*{{WikipediaCITE}}The cited source does not state that these men comprised ''Smith's'' "treasure-seeking company." Martin Harris was skeptical of the money diggers' claims, | *{{WikipediaCITE}}The cited source does not state that these men comprised ''Smith's'' "treasure-seeking company." Martin Harris was skeptical of the money diggers' claims, | ||
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Spying once again on the house of Samuel Lawrence, Smith, Sr. determined that a group of ten to twelve of these men, including Lawrence and Willard Chase, had enlisted the talents of a renowned and supposedly talented seer from 60 miles (96 km) away, in an effort to locate where the plates were hidden by means of [[divination]]. | Spying once again on the house of Samuel Lawrence, Smith, Sr. determined that a group of ten to twelve of these men, including Lawrence and Willard Chase, had enlisted the talents of a renowned and supposedly talented seer from 60 miles (96 km) away, in an effort to locate where the plates were hidden by means of [[divination]]. | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | *{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|p=102}}; {{Harvtxt|Salisbury|1895|p=15}} (saying that Smith's father "heard that they had got a conjurer, who they said would come and find the plates". | + | #*{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|p=102}}; {{Harvtxt|Salisbury|1895|p=15}} (saying that Smith's father "heard that they had got a conjurer, who they said would come and find the plates". |
|response= | |response= | ||
*{{WikipediaCorrect}} | *{{WikipediaCorrect}} | ||
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When Emma heard of this, she rode a stray horse to Macedon and informed Smith, Jr., | When Emma heard of this, she rode a stray horse to Macedon and informed Smith, Jr., | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | *{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|p=103}}; {{Harvtxt|Salisbury|1895|p=15}}. | + | #*{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|p=103}}; {{Harvtxt|Salisbury|1895|p=15}}. |
|response= | |response= | ||
*It sounds odd to say that Emma "rode a stray horse." Upon looking up the reference, we find that Joseph Smith, Sr. brought a horse that had strayed onto his farm to Emma to ride, since his own team of horses was not available. | *It sounds odd to say that Emma "rode a stray horse." Upon looking up the reference, we find that Joseph Smith, Sr. brought a horse that had strayed onto his farm to Emma to ride, since his own team of horses was not available. | ||
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who reportedly determined through his [[Urim and Thummim (Latter Day Saints)|Urim and Thummim]] that the plates were safe. He nevertheless hurriedly rode home with Emma. | who reportedly determined through his [[Urim and Thummim (Latter Day Saints)|Urim and Thummim]] that the plates were safe. He nevertheless hurriedly rode home with Emma. | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | *{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|pp=103–104}}. | + | #*{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|pp=103–104}}. |
|response= | |response= | ||
*{{WikipediaCorrect}} | *{{WikipediaCorrect}} | ||
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Once home in [[Manchester (town), New York|Manchester]], he said he walked to [[Cumorah]], removed the plates from their hiding place, and walked home through the woods and away from the road with the plates wrapped in a linen frock under his arm. | Once home in [[Manchester (town), New York|Manchester]], he said he walked to [[Cumorah]], removed the plates from their hiding place, and walked home through the woods and away from the road with the plates wrapped in a linen frock under his arm. | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | *{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|pp=104–06}}. | + | #*{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|pp=104–06}}. |
|response= | |response= | ||
*Again, the hill was not called "Cumorah" at this point in time. | *Again, the hill was not called "Cumorah" at this point in time. | ||
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On the way, he said a man had sprung up from behind a log and struck him a "heavy blow with a gun." "Knocking the man down with a single punch, Joseph ran as fast as he could for about a half mile before he was attacked by a second man trying to get the plates. After similarly overpowering the man, Joseph continued to run, but before he reached the house, a third man hit him with a gun. In striking the last man, Joseph said, he injured his thumb." | On the way, he said a man had sprung up from behind a log and struck him a "heavy blow with a gun." "Knocking the man down with a single punch, Joseph ran as fast as he could for about a half mile before he was attacked by a second man trying to get the plates. After similarly overpowering the man, Joseph continued to run, but before he reached the house, a third man hit him with a gun. In striking the last man, Joseph said, he injured his thumb." | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | *{{Harvtxt|Vogel|2004|p=99}}{{Harvtxt|Salisbury|1895|p=15}}; {{Harvtxt|Howe|1834|p=246}}; {{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|pp=104–06}}; {{Harvtxt|Harris|1859|p=166}}. | + | #*{{Harvtxt|Vogel|2004|p=99}}{{Harvtxt|Salisbury|1895|p=15}}; {{Harvtxt|Howe|1834|p=246}}; {{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|pp=104–06}}; {{Harvtxt|Harris|1859|p=166}}. |
|response= | |response= | ||
*{{WikipediaCorrect}} | *{{WikipediaCorrect}} | ||
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He returned home with a dislocated thumb and other minor injuries. | He returned home with a dislocated thumb and other minor injuries. | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | *{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|pp=104–06}} (mentioning the dislocated thumb); {{Harvtxt|Harris|1859|p=166}} (mentioning an injury to his side); {{Harvtxt|Salisbury|1895|p=15}} (mentioning the dislocated thumb and an injury to his arm). | + | #*{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|pp=104–06}} (mentioning the dislocated thumb); {{Harvtxt|Harris|1859|p=166}} (mentioning an injury to his side); {{Harvtxt|Salisbury|1895|p=15}} (mentioning the dislocated thumb and an injury to his arm). |
|response= | |response= | ||
*{{WikipediaCorrect}} | *{{WikipediaCorrect}} | ||
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Smith sent his father, [[Joseph Knight, Sr.|Joseph Knight]], and Josiah Stowell to search for the pursuers, but they found no one. | Smith sent his father, [[Joseph Knight, Sr.|Joseph Knight]], and Josiah Stowell to search for the pursuers, but they found no one. | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | *{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|pp=105–06}}; {{Harvtxt|Salisbury|1895|p=15}}. | + | #*{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|pp=105–06}}; {{Harvtxt|Salisbury|1895|p=15}}. |
|response= | |response= | ||
*{{WikipediaCorrect}} | *{{WikipediaCorrect}} | ||
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Smith is said to have put the plates in a locked chest and hid them in his parents' home in Manchester. | Smith is said to have put the plates in a locked chest and hid them in his parents' home in Manchester. | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | *{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|p=106}}; {{Harvtxt|Salisbury|1895|p=15}}. | + | #*{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|p=106}}; {{Harvtxt|Salisbury|1895|p=15}}. |
|response= | |response= | ||
*{{WikipediaCorrect}} | *{{WikipediaCorrect}} | ||
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He refused to allow anyone, including his family, to view the plates or the other artifacts he said he had in his possession, although some people were allowed to heft them or feel what were said to be the artifacts through a cloth. | He refused to allow anyone, including his family, to view the plates or the other artifacts he said he had in his possession, although some people were allowed to heft them or feel what were said to be the artifacts through a cloth. | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | *{{Harvtxt|Howe|1834|p=264}}; {{Harvtxt|Harris|1859|169–70}}; {{Harvtxt|Smith|1884}}. | + | #*{{Harvtxt|Howe|1834|p=264}}; {{Harvtxt|Harris|1859|169–70}}; {{Harvtxt|Smith|1884}}. |
|response= | |response= | ||
*{{WikipediaCorrect}} | *{{WikipediaCorrect}} | ||
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A few days after retrieving the plates, Smith brought home what he said was an ancient breastplate, which he said had been hidden in the box at Cumorah with the plates. After letting his mother feel through a thin cloth what she said was the breastplate, he placed it in the locked chest. | A few days after retrieving the plates, Smith brought home what he said was an ancient breastplate, which he said had been hidden in the box at Cumorah with the plates. After letting his mother feel through a thin cloth what she said was the breastplate, he placed it in the locked chest. | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | *{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|p=107}} (saying she saw the glistening metal, and estimating the breastplate's value at over 500 dollars). | + | #*{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|p=107}} (saying she saw the glistening metal, and estimating the breastplate's value at over 500 dollars). |
|response= | |response= | ||
*{{WikipediaCorrect}} | *{{WikipediaCorrect}} | ||
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The Smith home was approached "nearly every night" by villagers hoping to find the chest where Smith said the plates were kept. | The Smith home was approached "nearly every night" by villagers hoping to find the chest where Smith said the plates were kept. | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | *{{Harvtxt|Salisbury|1895|p=15}}. | + | #*{{Harvtxt|Salisbury|1895|p=15}}. |
|response= | |response= | ||
*{{WikipediaCorrect}} | *{{WikipediaCorrect}} | ||
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After hearing that a group of them would attempt to enter the house by force, Smith buried the chest under the hearth, | After hearing that a group of them would attempt to enter the house by force, Smith buried the chest under the hearth, | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | *{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|p=108}}; {{Harvtxt|Harris|1859|pp=166–67}}. | + | #*{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|p=108}}; {{Harvtxt|Harris|1859|pp=166–67}}. |
|response= | |response= | ||
*{{WikipediaCorrect}} | *{{WikipediaCorrect}} | ||
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and the family was able to scare away the intended intruders. | and the family was able to scare away the intended intruders. | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | *{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|p=108}}. | + | #*{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|p=108}}. |
|response= | |response= | ||
*{{WikipediaCorrect}} | *{{WikipediaCorrect}} | ||
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Fearing the chest might still be discovered, Smith hid it under the floor boards of his parents' old log home nearby, then being used as a [[cooper (profession)|cooper]] shop. | Fearing the chest might still be discovered, Smith hid it under the floor boards of his parents' old log home nearby, then being used as a [[cooper (profession)|cooper]] shop. | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | *{{Harvtxt|Harris|1859|p=167}} | + | #*{{Harvtxt|Harris|1859|p=167}} |
|response= | |response= | ||
*{{WikipediaCorrect}} | *{{WikipediaCorrect}} | ||
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Later, Smith told his mother he had taken the plates out of the chest, left the empty chest under the floor boards of the cooper shop, and hid the plates in a barrel of [[flax#Flax seed|flax]]. Shortly thereafter the empty box was discovered and the place ransacked by Smith's former treasure-seeking associates, | Later, Smith told his mother he had taken the plates out of the chest, left the empty chest under the floor boards of the cooper shop, and hid the plates in a barrel of [[flax#Flax seed|flax]]. Shortly thereafter the empty box was discovered and the place ransacked by Smith's former treasure-seeking associates, | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | *{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|pp=107–09}}; {{Harvtxt|Harris|1859|p=167}}. | + | #*{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|pp=107–09}}; {{Harvtxt|Harris|1859|p=167}}. |
|response= | |response= | ||
*{{WikipediaCITE}}The cited source does not call the mob "Smith's former treasure-seeking associates." This is inferred by the fact that Willard Chase's sister Sally attempted to locate the plates in the Cooper shop using a green stone. | *{{WikipediaCITE}}The cited source does not call the mob "Smith's former treasure-seeking associates." This is inferred by the fact that Willard Chase's sister Sally attempted to locate the plates in the Cooper shop using a green stone. | ||
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who had enlisted one of the men's sisters to find the hiding place by looking in her [[Seer stones in Mormonism|seer stone]]. | who had enlisted one of the men's sisters to find the hiding place by looking in her [[Seer stones in Mormonism|seer stone]]. | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | *{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|p=109}} The [[scrying|seer]] was the sister of Willard Chase who said she had "found a green glass, through which she could see many very wonderful things". | + | #*{{Harvtxt|Smith|1853|p=109}} The [[scrying|seer]] was the sister of Willard Chase who said she had "found a green glass, through which she could see many very wonderful things". |
|response= | |response= | ||
*{{WikipediaCorrect}} | *{{WikipediaCorrect}} | ||
Revision as of 20:59, 12 October 2017
- REDIRECTTemplate:Test3
An analysis of claims made in the Wikipedia article "Golden plates" - Receiving the plates
| Unsuccessful retrieval attempts | A FAIR Analysis of: Wikipedia article "Golden plates", a work by author: Various
|
Translating the plates |
An analysis of claims made in the Wikipedia article "Golden plates" - Receiving the plates
Updated 9/21/2011
Section review
Receiving the plates
The author(s) of Wikipedia article "Golden plates" make(s) the following claim:
The next annual visit on September 22, 1827 would be, Smith told associates, his last chance to receive the plates.Author's sources:
- Knight (1833) , p. 3.
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Wikipedia article "Golden plates" make(s) the following claim:
According to Brigham Young, as the scheduled final date to obtain the plates approached, several Palmyra residents expressed concern "that they were going to lose that treasure" and sent for a skilled necromancer from 60 miles (96 km) away, encouraging him to make three separate trips to Palmyra to find the plates.Author's sources:
- Young (1855) , p. 180.
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Wikipedia article "Golden plates" make(s) the following claim:
During one of these trips, the unnamed necromancer is said to have discovered the location, but was unable to determine the value of the plates.Author's sources:
- Young (1855) , pp. 180–81.
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Wikipedia article "Golden plates" make(s) the following claim:
A few days prior to the September 22, 1827 visit to the hill, Smith's loyal treasure-hunting friends Josiah Stowell and Joseph Knight, Sr. traveled to Palmyra, in part, to be there during Smith's scheduled visit to the hill.Author's sources:
- Knight (1833) , p. 3 (Saying Knight went to Rochester on business, and then passed back through Palmyra so that he could be there on September 22); Smith (1853) , p. 99 (Smith's mother, stating Knight and Stowell arrived there September 20, 1827 to inquire on business matters, but stayed at the Smith home until September 22).
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Wikipedia article "Golden plates" make(s) the following claim:
Another of Smith's former treasure-hunting associates, Samuel T. Lawrence, was also apparently aware of the approaching date to obtain the plates, and Smith was concerned he might cause trouble.Author's sources:
- Knight (1833) , p. 3 (saying Lawrence was a seer, had been to the hill, and knew what was there).
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Wikipedia article "Golden plates" make(s) the following claim:
Therefore, on the eve of September 22, 1827, the scheduled date for retrieving the plates, Smith dispatched his father to spy on Lawrence's house until dark. If Lawrence attempted to leave, the elder Joseph was to tell him that his son would "thrash the stumps with him" if he found him at the hill.Author's sources:
- Knight (1833) , p. 3
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Wikipedia article "Golden plates" make(s) the following claim:
Late at night, Smith took a horse and carriage to the hill Cumorah with his wife Emma.Author's sources:
- Smith (1853) , p. 100; Salisbury (1895) , p. 15 (Emma "didn't see the records, but she went with him").
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Wikipedia article "Golden plates" make(s) the following claim:
While Emma stayed behind kneeling in prayer,Author's sources:
- Harris (1853) , p. 164.
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Wikipedia article "Golden plates" make(s) the following claim:
Joseph walked to what he said was the site of the Golden Plates. Some time in the early morning hours, he said he retrieved the plates and hid them in a hollow log on or near Cumorah.Author's sources:
- Chase (1833) , p. 246; Smith (1850) , p. 104 (Smith had cut away the bark of a decaying log, placed the plates inside, then covered the log with debris); Harris (1859) , p. 165; Salisbury (1895) , p. 15 (saying Smith "brought them part way home and hid them in a hollow log").
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Wikipedia article "Golden plates" make(s) the following claim:
At the same time, Joseph said he received a pair of large spectacles he called the "Urim and Thummim" or "Interpreters", with lenses consisting of two seer stones, which he showed his mother when he returned in the morning.Author's sources:
- Smith (1853) , p. 101. Smith's friend Joseph Knight said Smith was even more fascinated by the Interpreters than the plates Knight (1833) , p. 3.
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Wikipedia article "Golden plates" make(s) the following claim:
Over the next few days, Smith took a well-digging job in nearby Macedon to earn enough money to buy a solid lockable chest in which to put the plates.Author's sources:
- Smith (1853) , p. 101.
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Wikipedia article "Golden plates" make(s) the following claim:
By then, however, some of Smith's treasure-seeking company had heard that Smith said he had been successful in obtaining the plates, and they wanted what they believed was their share of the profits from what they viewed as part of a joint venture in treasure hunting.Author's sources:
- Harris (1859) , p. 167.
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Wikipedia article "Golden plates" make(s) the following claim:
Spying once again on the house of Samuel Lawrence, Smith, Sr. determined that a group of ten to twelve of these men, including Lawrence and Willard Chase, had enlisted the talents of a renowned and supposedly talented seer from 60 miles (96 km) away, in an effort to locate where the plates were hidden by means of divination.Author's sources:
- Smith (1853) , p. 102; Salisbury (1895) , p. 15 (saying that Smith's father "heard that they had got a conjurer, who they said would come and find the plates".
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Wikipedia article "Golden plates" make(s) the following claim:
When Emma heard of this, she rode a stray horse to Macedon and informed Smith, Jr.,Author's sources:
- Smith (1853) , p. 103; Salisbury (1895) , p. 15.
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Wikipedia article "Golden plates" make(s) the following claim:
who reportedly determined through his Urim and Thummim that the plates were safe. He nevertheless hurriedly rode home with Emma.Author's sources:
- Smith (1853) , pp. 103–104.
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Wikipedia article "Golden plates" make(s) the following claim:
Once home in Manchester, he said he walked to Cumorah, removed the plates from their hiding place, and walked home through the woods and away from the road with the plates wrapped in a linen frock under his arm.Author's sources:
- Smith (1853) , pp. 104–06.
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Wikipedia article "Golden plates" make(s) the following claim:
On the way, he said a man had sprung up from behind a log and struck him a "heavy blow with a gun." "Knocking the man down with a single punch, Joseph ran as fast as he could for about a half mile before he was attacked by a second man trying to get the plates. After similarly overpowering the man, Joseph continued to run, but before he reached the house, a third man hit him with a gun. In striking the last man, Joseph said, he injured his thumb."Author's sources:
- Vogel (2004) , p. 99Salisbury (1895) , p. 15; Howe (1834) , p. 246; Smith (1853) , pp. 104–06; Harris (1859) , p. 166.
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Wikipedia article "Golden plates" make(s) the following claim:
He returned home with a dislocated thumb and other minor injuries.Author's sources:
- Smith (1853) , pp. 104–06 (mentioning the dislocated thumb); Harris (1859) , p. 166 (mentioning an injury to his side); Salisbury (1895) , p. 15 (mentioning the dislocated thumb and an injury to his arm).
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Wikipedia article "Golden plates" make(s) the following claim:
Smith sent his father, Joseph Knight, and Josiah Stowell to search for the pursuers, but they found no one.Author's sources:
- Smith (1853) , pp. 105–06; Salisbury (1895) , p. 15.
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Wikipedia article "Golden plates" make(s) the following claim:
Smith is said to have put the plates in a locked chest and hid them in his parents' home in Manchester.Author's sources:
- Smith (1853) , p. 106; Salisbury (1895) , p. 15.
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Wikipedia article "Golden plates" make(s) the following claim:
He refused to allow anyone, including his family, to view the plates or the other artifacts he said he had in his possession, although some people were allowed to heft them or feel what were said to be the artifacts through a cloth.Author's sources:
- Howe (1834) , p. 264; Harris (1859) ; Smith (1884) .
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Wikipedia article "Golden plates" make(s) the following claim:
A few days after retrieving the plates, Smith brought home what he said was an ancient breastplate, which he said had been hidden in the box at Cumorah with the plates. After letting his mother feel through a thin cloth what she said was the breastplate, he placed it in the locked chest.Author's sources:
- Smith (1853) , p. 107 (saying she saw the glistening metal, and estimating the breastplate's value at over 500 dollars).
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Wikipedia article "Golden plates" make(s) the following claim:
The Smith home was approached "nearly every night" by villagers hoping to find the chest where Smith said the plates were kept.Author's sources:
- Salisbury (1895) , p. 15.
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Wikipedia article "Golden plates" make(s) the following claim:
After hearing that a group of them would attempt to enter the house by force, Smith buried the chest under the hearth,Author's sources:
- Smith (1853) , p. 108; Harris (1859) , pp. 166–67.
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Wikipedia article "Golden plates" make(s) the following claim:
and the family was able to scare away the intended intruders.Author's sources:
- Smith (1853) , p. 108.
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Wikipedia article "Golden plates" make(s) the following claim:
Fearing the chest might still be discovered, Smith hid it under the floor boards of his parents' old log home nearby, then being used as a cooper shop.Author's sources:
- Harris (1859) , p. 167
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Wikipedia article "Golden plates" make(s) the following claim:
Later, Smith told his mother he had taken the plates out of the chest, left the empty chest under the floor boards of the cooper shop, and hid the plates in a barrel of flax. Shortly thereafter the empty box was discovered and the place ransacked by Smith's former treasure-seeking associates,Author's sources:
- Smith (1853) , pp. 107–09; Harris (1859) , p. 167.
FAIR's Response
The author(s) of Wikipedia article "Golden plates" make(s) the following claim:
who had enlisted one of the men's sisters to find the hiding place by looking in her seer stone.Author's sources:
- Smith (1853) , p. 109 The seer was the sister of Willard Chase who said she had "found a green glass, through which she could see many very wonderful things".
FAIR's Response
References
| Wikipedia references for "Golden Plates" |
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Further reading
Mormonism and Wikipedia
FairMormon's approach to Wikipedia articles
FairMormon regularly receives queries about specific LDS-themed Wikipedia articles with requests that we somehow "fix" them. Although some individual members of FAIR may choose to edit Wikipedia articles, FairMormon as an organization does not. Controversial Wikipedia articles require constant maintenance and a significant amount of time. We prefer instead to respond to claims in the FAIR Wiki rather than fight the ongoing battle that LDS Wikipedia articles sometimes invite. From FAIR’s perspective, assertions made in LDS-themed Wikipedia articles are therefore treated just like any other critical (or, if one prefers, "anti-Mormon") work. As those articles are revised and updated, we will periodically update our reviews to match.
Who can edit Wikipedia articles?
Editors who wish to participate in editing LDS-themed Wikipedia articles can access the project page here: Wikipedia:WikiProject Latter Day Saint movement. You are not required to be LDS in order to participate—there are a number of good non-LDS editors who have made valuable contributions to these articles.
Recommendations when editing Wikipedia articles
FAIR does not advocate removing any references from Wikipedia articles. The best approach to editing Wikipedia is to locate solid references to back up your position and add them rather than attempting to remove information. Individuals who intend to edit should be aware that posting information related to the real-world identities of Wikipedia editors will result in their being banned from editing Wikipedia. Attacking editors and attempting to "out" them on Wikipedia is considered very bad form. The best approach is to treat all Wikipedia editors, whether or not you agree or disagree with their approach, with respect and civility. An argumentative approach is not constructive to achieving a positive result, and will simply result in what is called an "edit war." Unfortunately, not all Wikipedia editors exhibit good faith toward other editors (see, for example, the comment above from "Duke53" or comments within these reviews made by John Foxe's sockpuppet "Hi540," both of whom repeatedly mocked LDS beliefs and LDS editors prior to their being banned.)
Do LDS editors control Wikipedia?
Although there exist editors on Wikipedia who openly declare their affiliation with the Church, they do not control Wikipedia. Ironically, some critics of the Church periodically falsely accuse Wikipedia editors of being LDS simply because they do not accept the critics' desired spin on a particular article.
Do "anti-Mormons" control Wikipedia?
Again, the answer is no. The truth is that Wikipedia is generally self-policing. Highly contentious articles do tend to draw the most passionate supporters and critics.
Why do certain LDS articles seem to be so negative?
Although some LDS-related Wikipedia articles may appear to have a negative tone, they are in reality quite a bit more balanced than certain critical works such as One Nation Under Gods. Although many critical editors often accuse LDS-related Wikipedia articles of being "faith promoting" or claim that they are just an extension of the Sunday School manual, this is rarely the case. Few, if any, Latter-day Saints would find Wikipedia articles to be "faith promoting." Generally, the believers think that the articles are too negative and the critics believe that the articles are too positive. LDS Wikipedia articles should be informative without being overtly faith promoting. However, most of the primary sources, including the words of Joseph Smith himself, are "faith promoting." This presents a dilemma for Wikipedia editors who want to remain neutral. The unfortunate consequence is that Joseph's words are rewritten and intermixed with contradictory sources, resulting in boring and confusing prose.
We examine selected Wikipedia articles and examine them on a "claim-by-claim" basis, with links to responses in the FairMormon Answers Wiki. Wikipedia articles are constantly evolving. As a result, the analysis of each article will be updated periodically in order to bring it more into line with the current version of the article. The latest revision date may be viewed at the top of each individual section. The process by which Wikipedia articles are reviewed is the following:
- Update each Wikipedia passage and its associated footnotes.
- Examine the use of sources and determine whether or not the passage accurately represents the source used.
- Provide links to response articles within the FairMormon Answers Wiki.
- If violation of Wikipedia rules is discovered, identify which Wikipedia editor (by pseudonym) made the edit, provide a description of the rule violated and a link to the Wikipedia "diff" showing the actual edit.
- If a violated rule is later corrected in a subsequent revision, the violation is removed and a notation is added that the passage is correct per cited sources. This doesn't mean that FAIR necessarily agrees with the passage—only that it is correct based upon the source used.
Interpreter: A Journal of Latter-day Saint Faith and Scholarship, "Mormonism and Wikipedia: The Church History That “Anyone Can Edit”"
Roger Nicholson, Interpreter: A Journal of Latter-day Saint Faith and Scholarship, (2012)The ability to quickly and easily access literature critical of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints has been made significantly easier through the advent of the Internet. One of the primary sites that dominates search engine results is Wikipedia, an online encyclopedia that “anyone can edit.” Wikipedia contains a large number of articles related to Mormonism that are edited by believers, critics, and neutral parties. The reliability of information regarding the Church and its history is subject to the biases of the editors who choose to modify those articles. Even if a wiki article is thoroughly sourced, editors sometimes employ source material in a manner that supports their bias. This essay explores the dynamics behind the creation of Wikipedia articles about the Church, the role that believers and critics play in that process, and the reliability of the information produced in the resulting wiki articles.
Click here to view the complete article
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