FAIR is a non-profit organization dedicated to providing well-documented answers to criticisms of the doctrine, practice, and history of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
Difference between revisions of "Events after the First Vision"
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|link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/Early knowledge of the nature of God | |link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/Early knowledge of the nature of God | ||
|subject=Joseph Smith's early knowledge of the nature of God | |subject=Joseph Smith's early knowledge of the nature of God | ||
| − | |summary= | + | |summary=It is claimed that Joseph began his prophetic career with a "trinitarian" idea of God, and only later developed his theology of the Godhead. What do we know about Joseph and the early Saints' views on God? |
| + | |sublink1=Question: Did Joseph begin his prophetic career with a "trinitarian" idea of God? | ||
| + | |sublink2=Question: Did Oliver Cowdery state that Joseph did not know if a "supreme being" existed in 1823? | ||
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|link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/No reference to First Vision in 1830s publications | |link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/No reference to First Vision in 1830s publications | ||
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|summary=It is claimed that there is no reference to the 1838 canonical First Vision story in any published material from the 1830s, and that nothing published in this period mentions that Joseph saw the Father and Son. They also assume that it would have been mentioned in the local newspapers at the time. | |summary=It is claimed that there is no reference to the 1838 canonical First Vision story in any published material from the 1830s, and that nothing published in this period mentions that Joseph saw the Father and Son. They also assume that it would have been mentioned in the local newspapers at the time. | ||
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|link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/Seldom mentioned in LDS publications before 1877 | |link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/Seldom mentioned in LDS publications before 1877 | ||
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|summary=It is claimed that, “Before the death of Brigham Young in 1877 the first vision was seldom mentioned in Mormon publications.” This evidence implies that the general membership of the LDS Church was not familiar with the First Vision story until late in the nineteenth century. | |summary=It is claimed that, “Before the death of Brigham Young in 1877 the first vision was seldom mentioned in Mormon publications.” This evidence implies that the general membership of the LDS Church was not familiar with the First Vision story until late in the nineteenth century. | ||
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|link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/Accounts/Brigham_Young_never_mentioned_the_First_Vision | |link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/Accounts/Brigham_Young_never_mentioned_the_First_Vision | ||
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|summary=It is claimed that Brigham Young never mentioned the First Vision. This is false. | |summary=It is claimed that Brigham Young never mentioned the First Vision. This is false. | ||
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|link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/No mention in non-LDS literature before 1843 | |link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/No mention in non-LDS literature before 1843 | ||
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|summary=It is claimed that there is no mention of the First Vision in non-Mormon literature before 1843, and that if the First Vision story had been known by the public before 1840 (when Orson Pratt published it in his pamphlet) that the anti-Mormons “surely” would have seized upon it as an evidence of Joseph Smith’s imposture. | |summary=It is claimed that there is no mention of the First Vision in non-Mormon literature before 1843, and that if the First Vision story had been known by the public before 1840 (when Orson Pratt published it in his pamphlet) that the anti-Mormons “surely” would have seized upon it as an evidence of Joseph Smith’s imposture. | ||
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|link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/1830 statement about seeing "God" | |link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/1830 statement about seeing "God" | ||
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|summary=Some have claimed that just because LDS missionaries were teaching around 1 November 1830 that Joseph Smith had previously seen “God” personally it cannot be assumed that this was a reference to God the Father since the Book of Mormon (completed ca. 11 June 1829) refers to Jesus Christ as “the eternal God” (title page; 2 Nephi 26:12). The argument is made that since this evidence indicates that Joseph Smith understood Jesus Christ to be “God” the statement by the missionaries may have simply meant that Joseph Smith had seen the Savior; not necessarily the Father. | |summary=Some have claimed that just because LDS missionaries were teaching around 1 November 1830 that Joseph Smith had previously seen “God” personally it cannot be assumed that this was a reference to God the Father since the Book of Mormon (completed ca. 11 June 1829) refers to Jesus Christ as “the eternal God” (title page; 2 Nephi 26:12). The argument is made that since this evidence indicates that Joseph Smith understood Jesus Christ to be “God” the statement by the missionaries may have simply meant that Joseph Smith had seen the Savior; not necessarily the Father. | ||
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|link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/Lack of contemporary Father and Son vision until 1838 | |link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/Lack of contemporary Father and Son vision until 1838 | ||
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|summary=It is claimed that there is no mention of Joseph Smith seeing the Father and Son in any “contemporary” newspaper, diary, LDS publication, or writing of any kind until the year 1838. | |summary=It is claimed that there is no mention of Joseph Smith seeing the Father and Son in any “contemporary” newspaper, diary, LDS publication, or writing of any kind until the year 1838. | ||
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|link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/Lucy Mack Smith and the Presbyterians | |link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/Lucy Mack Smith and the Presbyterians | ||
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|summary=It is claimed that since there was a religious revival in Palmyra, New York in 1824-25 which appears to match details of Joseph Smith's official Church history, he must have mistakenly mixed this event in with his narrative about what happened in 1820, and that the Prophet's mother joined the Presbyterian church after Alvin Smith died in late 1823. This contradicts Joseph's statement that she joined in 1820, thereby dating Joseph's First Vision to no earlier than 1823. | |summary=It is claimed that since there was a religious revival in Palmyra, New York in 1824-25 which appears to match details of Joseph Smith's official Church history, he must have mistakenly mixed this event in with his narrative about what happened in 1820, and that the Prophet's mother joined the Presbyterian church after Alvin Smith died in late 1823. This contradicts Joseph's statement that she joined in 1820, thereby dating Joseph's First Vision to no earlier than 1823. | ||
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|link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/Joseph Smith joined other churches | |link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/Joseph Smith joined other churches | ||
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|summary=It is claimed that Joseph Smith joined the Methodist, Presbyterian, and Baptist churches between 1820 and 1830—despite the claim made in his 1838 history that he was forbidden by Deity (during the 1820 First Vision experience) from joining any denomination. | |summary=It is claimed that Joseph Smith joined the Methodist, Presbyterian, and Baptist churches between 1820 and 1830—despite the claim made in his 1838 history that he was forbidden by Deity (during the 1820 First Vision experience) from joining any denomination. | ||
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|link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/Contradiction about knowing all churches were wrong | |link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/Contradiction about knowing all churches were wrong | ||
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|summary=In his 1832 account of the First Vision, Joseph Smith said, “I found [by searching the scriptures] that mankind did not come unto the Lord but that they had apostatized from the true and living faith and there was no society or denomination that built upon the gospel of Jesus Christ as recorded in the New Testament.” But in the 1835 account he said, “I knew not who [of the denominations] was right or who was wrong.” It is claimed that thus counts as evidence that the First Vision story evolved over time. | |summary=In his 1832 account of the First Vision, Joseph Smith said, “I found [by searching the scriptures] that mankind did not come unto the Lord but that they had apostatized from the true and living faith and there was no society or denomination that built upon the gospel of Jesus Christ as recorded in the New Testament.” But in the 1835 account he said, “I knew not who [of the denominations] was right or who was wrong.” It is claimed that thus counts as evidence that the First Vision story evolved over time. | ||
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|link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/Fabricated to give "Godly authority" | |link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/Fabricated to give "Godly authority" | ||
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|summary=It is claimed that Joseph Smith decided after he released the Book of Mormon to the public that he needed 'authority from God' to justify his claims as a religious minister. Therefore, it is claimed that he fabricated the First Vision story in order to provide himself with a more prestigious line of authority than that of the "angel" who revealed the golden plates. | |summary=It is claimed that Joseph Smith decided after he released the Book of Mormon to the public that he needed 'authority from God' to justify his claims as a religious minister. Therefore, it is claimed that he fabricated the First Vision story in order to provide himself with a more prestigious line of authority than that of the "angel" who revealed the golden plates. | ||
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|link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/Story became more detailed and colorful after 1832 | |link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/Story became more detailed and colorful after 1832 | ||
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|summary=Some claim that Joseph Smith’s account of the First Vision grew more detailed and more colorful after he first recorded it in 1832. | |summary=Some claim that Joseph Smith’s account of the First Vision grew more detailed and more colorful after he first recorded it in 1832. | ||
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|link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/Accounts/1838/Account modified to offset leadership crisis | |link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/Accounts/1838/Account modified to offset leadership crisis | ||
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|summary=It is claimed that in 1838 Joseph Smith revised his personal history to say that his original call came from God the Father and Jesus Christ rather than an angel. His motive for doing this was to give himself a stronger leadership role because an authority crisis had recently taken place and large-scale apostasy was the result. | |summary=It is claimed that in 1838 Joseph Smith revised his personal history to say that his original call came from God the Father and Jesus Christ rather than an angel. His motive for doing this was to give himself a stronger leadership role because an authority crisis had recently taken place and large-scale apostasy was the result. | ||
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|link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/Persecution after the vision | |link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/Persecution after the vision | ||
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|summary=Some claim that there is no evidence that Joseph or his family were persecuted because of the First Vision. They argue that this means that Joseph invented the story later. | |summary=Some claim that there is no evidence that Joseph or his family were persecuted because of the First Vision. They argue that this means that Joseph invented the story later. | ||
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|link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/Andrew Jenson called personage an "angel" | |link=Joseph Smith's First Vision/Andrew Jenson called personage an "angel" | ||
Revision as of 16:49, 14 April 2017
- REDIRECTTemplate:Test3
Contents
- 1 Criticisms of events occurring after the First Vision
- 1.1 Criticisms of events occurring after the First Vision
- 1.1.1
- 1.1.2 Joseph Smith's early knowledge of the nature of God
- 1.1.3 No reference to First Vision in 1830s publications
- 1.1.4 Seldom mentioned in LDS publications before 1877
- 1.1.5 Brigham Young never mentioned the First Vision?
- 1.1.6 No mention in non-LDS literature before 1843
- 1.1.7 Missionaries 1830 statement about Joseph seeing "God"
- 1.1.8 No published reference to Father and Son vision until 1838?
- 1.1.9 Lucy Mack Smith and the Presbyterians
- 1.1.10 Did Joseph join other churches contrary to commandment in vision?
- 1.1.11 Contradiction about knowing all churches were wrong
- 1.1.12 First Vision fabricated to give "Godly authority?"
- 1.1.13 First Vision story became more detailed and colorful after 1832?
- 1.1.14 1838 account modified to offset leadership crisis?
- 1.1.15 Persecution after the vision?
- 1.1.16 Andrew Jenson called one of the personages in the First Vision an "angel"
- 1.1 Criticisms of events occurring after the First Vision
Criticisms of events occurring after the First Vision
Criticisms of events occurring after the First Vision