Difference between revisions of "Criticism of Mormonism/Books/American Massacre/Chapter 15"

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|author=Sally Denton
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|H=Response to claims made in Chapter 15: "Mountain Meadows, March 23, 1877"
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|section=[[../../Index/|Index of claims]]: Chapter 15
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[[File:Chart AM chapter 15.png|center|frame]]
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{{H2
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|L=Criticism of Mormonism/Books/American Massacre/Chapter 15
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|H=Response to claims made in American Massacre: The Tragedy at Mountain Meadows, "Chapter 15: Mountain Meadows, March 23, 1877"
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|S=
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|L1=Response to claim: 222 - The author claims that a "Jack Mormon" is one "who is not devout but not apostate"
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|L2=Response to claim: 224 - The "Mormon euphemism for blood-atoning murders" was to be "put away"
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|L3=Response to claim: 227 - John D. Lee denied that Brigham Young ordered the massacre because he believed that Brigham "would protect him from harm"
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|L4=Response to claim: 228 - Young fully realized that the Mountain Meadows Massacre would continue to plague him until someone was held accountable for the crime
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|L5=Response to claim: 230 - John D. Lee chose to be shot rather than beheaded as "a clear signal to the faithful that he rejected a spiritual need to atone for any sins"
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|L6=Response to claim: 233 - Before he is executed, Lee makes a statement against Brigham Young, saying that "I do not agree with him. I believe he is leading the people astray..."
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}}
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==Response to claim: 222 - The author claims that a "Jack Mormon" is one "who is not devout but not apostate"==
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{{IndexClaimItemShort
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|title=American Massacre
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|claim=
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The author claims that a "Jack Mormon" is one "who is not devout but not apostate."
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|authorsources=<br>
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#No source given.
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}}
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{{disinformation|In ''modern'' usage, a "Jack Mormon" may sometimes refer to a less-active or less-observant Latter-day Saint. <ref>The modern usage of "jack mormon" can be seen in the user-edited [http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=jack%20mormon Urban Dictionary] (accessed 17 June 2009).  See also Pat Bagley, "'Jack Mormon' once meant something else" ''Salt Lake Tribune'' (13 January 2008): B4.</ref>
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In the nineteenth century, however, a "Jack Mormon" was a ''non''-Mormon who was nevertheless sympathetic or friendly to Mormons. <ref>See {{CHC1|vol=2|start=332 note}} Thomas Sharp (hostile editor of the ''Warsaw Signal'') is the first known to have used the term in print (see ''Illinois State Register'' [1 Nov 1844]; reprinted in ''Nauvoo Neighbor'' [13 Nov 1844].)</ref>
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}}
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==Response to claim: 224 - The "Mormon euphemism for blood-atoning murders" was to be "put away"==
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{{IndexClaimItemShort
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|title=American Massacre
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|claim=
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The "Mormon euphemism for blood-atoning murders" was to be "put away."
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|authorsources=<br>
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*Klingensmith testimony, Brooks, ''Mountain Meadows Witness'', 191.
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*Lee, 339
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*Fielding, ''Tribune Reports'', 109.
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}}
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{{propaganda|The author here relies only on the testimony of convicted murderer Lee, and self-confessed murderer Klingensmith (who turned state's evidence for immunity).
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}}
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==Response to claim: 227 - John D. Lee denied that Brigham Young ordered the massacre because he believed that Brigham "would protect him from harm"==
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{{IndexClaimItemShort
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|title=American Massacre
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|claim=
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John D. Lee denied that Brigham Young ordered the massacre because he believed that Brigham "would protect him from harm."
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|authorsources=<br>
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#Author's opinion.
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}}
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{{disinformation|Lee had the chance for immunity if he would turn evidence against Brigham: "both Orson F. Whitney and the ''New York Herald'' reported that Howard offered Lee a full pardon in exchange for evidence against Brigham Young." <ref>{{FR-16-1-9}}</ref>  That he never did so strongly suggests he had no such evidence.
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}}
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==Response to claim: 228 - Young fully realized that the Mountain Meadows Massacre would continue to plague him until someone was held accountable for the crime==
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{{IndexClaimItemShort
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|title=American Massacre
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|claim=
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{{AuthorQuote|Young fully realized that the Mountain Meadows Massacre would continue to plague him until someone was held accountable for the crime. In a calculated and mutually beneficial deal, Young and Howard came to terms. Young would make available all witnesses and evidence necessary for a conviction of Lee. In exchange, Howard would limit the testimony implicating Young, George Smith, and other church leaders in the affair, and drop charges against Dame. It was an extraordinary quid pro quo that neither side apparently committed to writing.}}
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|authorsources=<br>
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*{{CriticalWork:Bagley:Blood of the Prophets|pages=300}}
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*''Salt Lake Tribune Reports'' published in Fielding, 207.
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}}
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{{propaganda|If it was never committed to writing, how does the author know about it? The author here again follows Bagley uncritically.
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}}
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*{{Detail_old|Brigham Young/Prosecution of Mountain Meadows Massacre/Deal with Brigham Young|l1=Deal with Brigham Young for massacre prosecution?}}
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==Response to claim: 230 - John D. Lee chose to be shot rather than beheaded as "a clear signal to the faithful that he rejected a spiritual need to atone for any sins"==
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{{IndexClaimItemShort
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|title=American Massacre
 +
|claim=
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John D. Lee chose to be shot rather than beheaded as "a clear signal to the faithful that he rejected a spiritual need to atone for any sins."
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|authorsources=<br>
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#No source provided.
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}}
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{{propaganda|How do we know this signal was clear?  How do we know what he intended?  How do we know how others understood it? Evidence is needed. It is not clear why a convicted murderer's insistence that he had done nothing wrong tells us anything except that which we already knew&mdash;the murderer is callous with no regard for moral laws.
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}}
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==Response to claim: 233 - Before he is executed, Lee makes a statement against Brigham Young, saying that "I do not agree with him. I believe he is leading the people astray..."==
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{{IndexClaimItemShort
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|title=American Massacre
 +
|claim=
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Before he is executed, Lee makes a statement against Brigham Young, saying that "I do not agree with him. I believe he is leading the people astray..."
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|authorsources=<br>
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#No source is provided for any of the lengthy quoted comments on page 233.
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}}
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{{misinformation|This quotation argues ''against'' the posthumous claims made in Lee's "confession," upon which Denton bases her case.  If Lee was about to be executed, why would he only claim Brigham was leading the people astray&mdash;why would he write an expose of Brigham's complicity in the Massacre, and then not announce at his execution (or before) that Brigham was guilty of ordering the murders?
 
}}
 
}}
  
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===Claims made in Chapter 15: "Mountain Meadows Aftermath"===
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{{endnotes sources}}
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{{BeginClaimsTable}}
 
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====237====
 
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*Lee's biography, published by his lawyer after his death, claimed that the Church ordered the massacre.
 
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* Lee's self-serving effort to blame others for the massacre is not terribly persuasive in the absence of other corroborating evidence.  There is a great deal of contemporaneous evidence which shows that it was ''local'' leaders who ordered the Massacre, not "the Church" or its general leaders such as Brigham Young.
 
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* [[Brigham_Young_ordered_MMM|Brigham ordered the Massacre?]]
 
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*''New York Herald'', March 21, 1876.
 
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*''San Francisco Chronicle''
 
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*''Salt Lake Daily Tribune''
 
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*''Pioche Record'', Pioche, Nevada.
 
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====238====
 
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*Lee's book ''Mormonism Unveiled or Life & Confession of John D. Lee'' "has generally been determined valid and credible by later scholars of the event, though some have believed Bishop embellished it."
 
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* It is true that Lee's memoir is considered "valid and credible by later scholars" if by "later scholars" one means "hostile authors who wish to blame the Church as an institution and Brigham Young," such as [[Blood_of_the_Prophets:_Brigham_Young_and_the_Massacre_at_Mountain_Meadows#Reviews_of_this_work|Bagley]], [[Under_the_Banner_of_Heaven#Reviews of this work|Krakauer]], or Stenhouse.
 
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* This is assuredly ''not'' true of the broader scholarly consensus.
 
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*Author's opinion.
 
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====238====
 
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*Lee predicted that Brigham would die within six months of Lee's death if Lee were not guilty. Brigham died six months after Lee.
 
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* {{DoubleStandard}}: Such a claim is dramatic, but irrelevant unless one grants prophetic gifts and powers to Lee.
 
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*{{CriticalWork:Bagley:Blood of the Prophets|pages=319}}
 
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====293====
 
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*The author claims special insight into the LDS psyche.
 
  
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<!-- PLEASE DO NOT REMOVE ANYTHING BELOW THIS LINE -->
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* "Her suggestion that she is an insider to the Latter-day Saint psyche proves unconvincing because she makes mistakes that careful historians of Mormon Americana do not."{{ref|psyche.1}}
 
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*{{attn}}
 
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{{EndTable}}
 

Latest revision as of 00:04, 31 May 2024

Contents

Response to claims made in Chapter 15: "Mountain Meadows, March 23, 1877"



Chapter 14
A FAIR Analysis of: American Massacre: The Tragedy at Mountain Meadows, a work by author: Sally Denton
 		Chapter 16
Chart AM chapter 15.png

Response to claims made in American Massacre: The Tragedy at Mountain Meadows, "Chapter 15: Mountain Meadows, March 23, 1877"


Jump to details:


Response to claim: 222 - The author claims that a "Jack Mormon" is one "who is not devout but not apostate"

The author(s) of American Massacre make(s) the following claim:

The author claims that a "Jack Mormon" is one "who is not devout but not apostate."

Author's sources:
  1. No source given.

FAIR's Response

Fact checking results: This claim is false

In modern usage, a "Jack Mormon" may sometimes refer to a less-active or less-observant Latter-day Saint. [1]

In the nineteenth century, however, a "Jack Mormon" was a non-Mormon who was nevertheless sympathetic or friendly to Mormons. [2]


Response to claim: 224 - The "Mormon euphemism for blood-atoning murders" was to be "put away"

The author(s) of American Massacre make(s) the following claim:

The "Mormon euphemism for blood-atoning murders" was to be "put away."

Author's sources:
  • Klingensmith testimony, Brooks, Mountain Meadows Witness, 191.
  • Lee, 339
  • Fielding, Tribune Reports, 109.

FAIR's Response

Fact checking results: This claim contains propaganda - The author, or the author's source, is providing information or ideas in a slanted way in order to instill a particular attitude or response in the reader

The author here relies only on the testimony of convicted murderer Lee, and self-confessed murderer Klingensmith (who turned state's evidence for immunity).


Response to claim: 227 - John D. Lee denied that Brigham Young ordered the massacre because he believed that Brigham "would protect him from harm"

The author(s) of American Massacre make(s) the following claim:

John D. Lee denied that Brigham Young ordered the massacre because he believed that Brigham "would protect him from harm."

Author's sources:
  1. Author's opinion.

FAIR's Response

Fact checking results: This claim is false

Lee had the chance for immunity if he would turn evidence against Brigham: "both Orson F. Whitney and the New York Herald reported that Howard offered Lee a full pardon in exchange for evidence against Brigham Young." [3] That he never did so strongly suggests he had no such evidence.


Response to claim: 228 - Young fully realized that the Mountain Meadows Massacre would continue to plague him until someone was held accountable for the crime

The author(s) of American Massacre make(s) the following claim:

 Author's quote: Young fully realized that the Mountain Meadows Massacre would continue to plague him until someone was held accountable for the crime. In a calculated and mutually beneficial deal, Young and Howard came to terms. Young would make available all witnesses and evidence necessary for a conviction of Lee. In exchange, Howard would limit the testimony implicating Young, George Smith, and other church leaders in the affair, and drop charges against Dame. It was an extraordinary quid pro quo that neither side apparently committed to writing.

Author's sources:

FAIR's Response

Fact checking results: This claim contains propaganda - The author, or the author's source, is providing information or ideas in a slanted way in order to instill a particular attitude or response in the reader

If it was never committed to writing, how does the author know about it? The author here again follows Bagley uncritically.

Response to claim: 230 - John D. Lee chose to be shot rather than beheaded as "a clear signal to the faithful that he rejected a spiritual need to atone for any sins"

The author(s) of American Massacre make(s) the following claim:

John D. Lee chose to be shot rather than beheaded as "a clear signal to the faithful that he rejected a spiritual need to atone for any sins."

Author's sources:
  1. No source provided.

FAIR's Response

Fact checking results: This claim contains propaganda - The author, or the author's source, is providing information or ideas in a slanted way in order to instill a particular attitude or response in the reader

How do we know this signal was clear? How do we know what he intended? How do we know how others understood it? Evidence is needed. It is not clear why a convicted murderer's insistence that he had done nothing wrong tells us anything except that which we already knew—the murderer is callous with no regard for moral laws.


Response to claim: 233 - Before he is executed, Lee makes a statement against Brigham Young, saying that "I do not agree with him. I believe he is leading the people astray..."

The author(s) of American Massacre make(s) the following claim:

Before he is executed, Lee makes a statement against Brigham Young, saying that "I do not agree with him. I believe he is leading the people astray..."

Author's sources:
  1. No source is provided for any of the lengthy quoted comments on page 233.

FAIR's Response

Fact checking results: The author has stated erroneous information or misinterpreted their sources

This quotation argues against the posthumous claims made in Lee's "confession," upon which Denton bases her case. If Lee was about to be executed, why would he only claim Brigham was leading the people astray—why would he write an expose of Brigham's complicity in the Massacre, and then not announce at his execution (or before) that Brigham was guilty of ordering the murders?


Notes

  1. ↑ The modern usage of "jack mormon" can be seen in the user-edited Urban Dictionary (accessed 17 June 2009). See also Pat Bagley, "'Jack Mormon' once meant something else" Salt Lake Tribune (13 January 2008): B4.
  2. ↑ See Brigham H. Roberts, Comprehensive History of the Church (Provo, Utah: Brigham Young University Press, 1965), 2:332 note. GospeLink Thomas Sharp (hostile editor of the Warsaw Signal) is the first known to have used the term in print (see Illinois State Register [1 Nov 1844]; reprinted in Nauvoo Neighbor [13 Nov 1844].)
  3. ↑ Robert D. Crockett, "The Denton Debacle (Review of: American Massacre: The Tragedy at Mountain Meadows, September 1857)," FARMS Review 16/1 (2004): 135–148. off-site


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