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==Question: Did David Whitmer believe his witness experience was "only a vision"?== | ==Question: Did David Whitmer believe his witness experience was "only a vision"?== | ||
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:"Persons may attempt to describe the presentation of the plates as shown to himself and other witnesses, but there was a glory attending it that no one could describe, no human tongue could tell the glorious scenes that were presented to them. Joseph Smith was there and Oliver Cowdery and himself--Martin Harris did not come as expected, but they were shown to him a short time after."<ref>David Whitmer, interview with James H. Hart on 21 August 1883, Letter to ''Deseret News'' (23 August 1883); cited in {{EMD|vol=5|pages=97}}</ref> | :"Persons may attempt to describe the presentation of the plates as shown to himself and other witnesses, but there was a glory attending it that no one could describe, no human tongue could tell the glorious scenes that were presented to them. Joseph Smith was there and Oliver Cowdery and himself--Martin Harris did not come as expected, but they were shown to him a short time after."<ref>David Whitmer, interview with James H. Hart on 21 August 1883, Letter to ''Deseret News'' (23 August 1883); cited in {{EMD|vol=5|pages=97}}</ref> | ||
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+ | ===Seeing with "natural eyes"=== | ||
+ | In another account, Whitmer described seeing with his "natural eyes": | ||
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+ | : I [the interviewer] asked him [Whitmer] if the table, which the angel brought, and upon which the plates lay when he viewed them '''was a tangible one''', and he said that he did not touch it, it had the semblance of a table. The then ex=plained that he saw the plates and '''with his natural eyes''', but he had to be prepared for it--that he and the other witnesses were overshadowed by the power of God and a halo of brightness indescribable (emphasis added).<ref>David Whitmer, interview with Nathan Tanner, Jr., Journal, 13 May 1886, [50-61], Church Archives; cited in {{EMD|vol=5|pages=166}}</ref> | ||
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+ | Whitmer was careful not to testify to things he could not say--he had not touched the table, so he would not say that it was tangible. But, he makes it clear that his witness experience was literal, and involved his "natural eyes," not a merely internal experience. In another account: | ||
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+ | <blockquote>After talking as he did, so fully and freely he said "I have been asked if we saw those things with '''our natural eyes. Of course they were our natural eyes There is no doubt that our eyes were prepared for the sight, but they were our natural eyes nevertheless'''." | ||
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+ | I asked him if the table was a tangible one, and he said it appeared to be, but they did not touch it.<ref>David Whitmer, interview with Nathan Tanner, Jr., Letter to Nathan A. Tanner, 17 February 1909, typed copy, Church Archives; cited in {{EMD|vol=5|pages=170}}</ref></blockquote> | ||
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+ | A later account has Whitmer insist that their vision was not altered in its natural character, saying that it was "as it is at any time," save it was prepared by God to tolerate an angelic visit: | ||
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+ | <blockquote>In regards to my testimony to the visitation of the angel, who declared to us three witnesses that the Book of Mormon is true, I have this to say: Of course we were in the spirit when we had the view, for no man can behold the face of an angel, except in a spiritual view, but '''we were in the body also, and everything was as natural to us, '''as it is at any time'''''. Martin Harris, you say, called it "being in vision." We read in the Scriptures, Cornelius saw, in a vision, an angel of God, Daniel saw an angel in a vision, also in other places it states they saw an angel in the spirit. A bright light enveloped us where we were, that filled [the woods as] at noon day, and there in a ''vision'' or in the ''spirit'', we saw and heard just as it is stated in my testimony in the Book of Mormon (emphasis and italics added).<ref>David Whitmer, to Anthony Metcalf, 2 April 1887; printed in A[nthony] Metcalf, ''Ten Years before the Mast'' ([Malad City, Idaho]: n.p. [1888]), 73-74, italics in original; cited in {{EMD|vol=5|pages=193}}</ref></blockquote> | ||
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+ | ===Setting is prosaic, not in prayer, meditation, or an altered mental state=== | ||
Furthermore, the experience did not occur in the midst of a religious excitement or prayer. They prayed, and then sat on a log, and as they were talking they had the witness experience: | Furthermore, the experience did not occur in the midst of a religious excitement or prayer. They prayed, and then sat on a log, and as they were talking they had the witness experience: | ||
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Again we see that the difficulty lies in describing the spiritual elements, but this is clearly a literal experience, not an internal, subjective visionary or enthusiastic transport. | Again we see that the difficulty lies in describing the spiritual elements, but this is clearly a literal experience, not an internal, subjective visionary or enthusiastic transport. | ||
− | Another account has Whitmer say: | + | Another account has Whitmer say of the difficulty of describing all elements of the witness experience: |
:He was plowing when Joseph and Oliver came to him and the former told him that he was chosen to be one of the three witnesses to whom the angel would show the plates. He also told him that the Lord had promised to make this manifest and now was the time. | :He was plowing when Joseph and Oliver came to him and the former told him that he was chosen to be one of the three witnesses to whom the angel would show the plates. He also told him that the Lord had promised to make this manifest and now was the time. | ||
− | :They went out and sat upon a log conversing upon the things to be revealed when they were surrounded by a glorious light which overshadowed them. A glorious personage appeared and he showed to them the plates....Human language could not, he said, describe heavenly things and that which they saw. The language of the angel was: Blessed is he that believed and remaineth faitful to the end. He had his hours of darkness and trial and difficulty, but however dark upon other things[,] that had ever been a bright scene in his mind and he had never wavered in regard to it; he had testified fearlessly always of it, even when his life was threatened. Martin Harris was not with them at the time that he and Oliver saw the angel, but he and Joseph afterwards saw the same, and he thus became a witness also.<ref>David Whitmer, Interview with George Q. Cannon, Journal, 27 February 1884, | + | :They went out and sat upon a log conversing upon the things to be revealed when they were surrounded by a glorious light which overshadowed them. A glorious personage appeared and he showed to them the plates....Human language could not, he said, describe heavenly things and that which they saw. The language of the angel was: Blessed is he that believed and remaineth faitful to the end. He had his hours of darkness and trial and difficulty, but however dark upon other things[,] that had ever been a bright scene in his mind and he had never wavered in regard to it; he had testified fearlessly always of it, even when his life was threatened. Martin Harris was not with them at the time that he and Oliver saw the angel, but he and Joseph afterwards saw the same, and he thus became a witness also.<ref>David Whitmer, Interview with George Q. Cannon, Journal, 27 February 1884, Church Archives; cited in {{EMD|vol=5|pages=113}}</ref> |
Elsewhere he described the "solemnity" of feeling that accompanied the experience: | Elsewhere he described the "solemnity" of feeling that accompanied the experience: | ||
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This analysis corresponds closely to the description offered by Whitmer in other interviews (emphasis added in all cases): | This analysis corresponds closely to the description offered by Whitmer in other interviews (emphasis added in all cases): | ||
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{{:Source:_David_Whitmer_literal_experience_quotes}} | {{:Source:_David_Whitmer_literal_experience_quotes}} | ||
</onlyinclude> | </onlyinclude> | ||
{{endnotes sources}} | {{endnotes sources}} | ||
+ | [[Category:Questions]] |
Contents |
Zenos H. Gurley reported an interview in which David Whitmer described his witness of the plates as occurring “in the holy vision.”
Some have attempted to make this an admission that the experience was not “literal” because there was a visionary aspect to it.
A more complete look at the text lets us discern Whitmer’s meaning:
- 1[Q] — Do you know that the plates seen with the Angel on the table) were real metal, did you touch them?
- Ans We did not touch nor handle the plates
- 2 Q — Was the table literal wood? Or was the whole a vision such as often occurs in dreams &c.
- Ans—The table had the appearance of literal wood as shown in the vision, in the glory of God.[1]
Whitmer makes the distinction clear—this is not “as often occurs in dreams,” things have the literal appearance. This does not mean, however, that it was not also a “vision,” however, since they were “in the glory of God.” As Whitmer said on another occasion:
In another account, Whitmer described seeing with his "natural eyes":
Whitmer was careful not to testify to things he could not say--he had not touched the table, so he would not say that it was tangible. But, he makes it clear that his witness experience was literal, and involved his "natural eyes," not a merely internal experience. In another account:
After talking as he did, so fully and freely he said "I have been asked if we saw those things with our natural eyes. Of course they were our natural eyes There is no doubt that our eyes were prepared for the sight, but they were our natural eyes nevertheless." I asked him if the table was a tangible one, and he said it appeared to be, but they did not touch it.[4]
A later account has Whitmer insist that their vision was not altered in its natural character, saying that it was "as it is at any time," save it was prepared by God to tolerate an angelic visit:
In regards to my testimony to the visitation of the angel, who declared to us three witnesses that the Book of Mormon is true, I have this to say: Of course we were in the spirit when we had the view, for no man can behold the face of an angel, except in a spiritual view, but 'we were in the body also, and everything was as natural to us, as it is at any time. Martin Harris, you say, called it "being in vision." We read in the Scriptures, Cornelius saw, in a vision, an angel of God, Daniel saw an angel in a vision, also in other places it states they saw an angel in the spirit. A bright light enveloped us where we were, that filled [the woods as] at noon day, and there in a vision or in the spirit, we saw and heard just as it is stated in my testimony in the Book of Mormon (emphasis and italics added).[5]
Furthermore, the experience did not occur in the midst of a religious excitement or prayer. They prayed, and then sat on a log, and as they were talking they had the witness experience:
Again we see that the difficulty lies in describing the spiritual elements, but this is clearly a literal experience, not an internal, subjective visionary or enthusiastic transport.
Another account has Whitmer say of the difficulty of describing all elements of the witness experience:
Elsewhere he described the "solemnity" of feeling that accompanied the experience:
This analysis corresponds closely to the description offered by Whitmer in other interviews (emphasis added in all cases):
Notes
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