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Difference between revisions of "Criticism of Mormonism/Books/American Massacre/Chapter 4"
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| − | + | {{H1 | |
| − | + | |L=Criticism of Mormonism/Books/American Massacre/Chapter 4 | |
| − | | | + | |H=Response to claims made in "Chapter Four: Winter Quarters—Council Bluffs, 1846" |
| − | | | + | |S= |
| − | | | + | |L1= |
| − | + | |T=[[../../|American Massacre: The Tragedy at Mountain Meadows]] | |
| − | + | |A=Sally Denton | |
| − | | | + | |<=[[../Chapter 3|Chapter 3]] |
| − | + | |>=[[../Chapter 5|Chapter 5]] | |
}} | }} | ||
| + | [[File:Chart AM chapter 4.png|center|frame]] | ||
| + | <onlyinclude> | ||
| + | {{H2 | ||
| + | |L=Criticism of Mormonism/Books/American Massacre/Chapter 4 | ||
| + | |H=Response to claims made in American Massacre: The Tragedy at Mountain Meadows, "Chapter Four: Winter Quarters—Council Bluffs, 1846" | ||
| + | |S= | ||
| + | |L1=Response to claim: 42 - The author blames Col. Thomas Kane for helping to cover up the Massacre | ||
| + | |L2=Response to claim: 53 - The author claims that John D. Lee was sent by Brigham to intercept the payroll from the Mormon battalion in order to consecrate it to the Church | ||
| + | |L3=Response to claim: 54 - he author claims that Brigham declared "his own death and resurrection" | ||
| + | |L4=Response to claim: 55 - The author claims that Brigham "overcame resistance" from the Council of the Twelve and "finalized his own ascendancy" in order to be "elevated to a deity" | ||
| + | |L5=Response to claim: 59 - The author claims that Brigham Young "gave an ominous warning to all who had come. From this point forward, anyone who refused to live the laws about to be set forth was free to leave" | ||
| + | }} | ||
| + | </onlyinclude> | ||
==Response to claim: 42 - The author blames Col. Thomas Kane for helping to cover up the Massacre== | ==Response to claim: 42 - The author blames Col. Thomas Kane for helping to cover up the Massacre== | ||
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|title=American Massacre | |title=American Massacre | ||
|claim=The author blames Col. Thomas Kane for helping to cover up the Massacre. | |claim=The author blames Col. Thomas Kane for helping to cover up the Massacre. | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | }} | + | #}} |
| − | {{ | + | {{propaganda|This claim by the author is nonsense.}} |
| − | + | {{:Question: Did Colonel Thomas Kane attempt to cover up the Mountain Meadows Massacre?}} | |
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==Response to claim: 53 - The author claims that John D. Lee was sent by Brigham to intercept the payroll from the Mormon battalion in order to consecrate it to the Church== | ==Response to claim: 53 - The author claims that John D. Lee was sent by Brigham to intercept the payroll from the Mormon battalion in order to consecrate it to the Church== | ||
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|title=American Massacre | |title=American Massacre | ||
|claim=The author claims that John D. Lee was sent by Brigham to intercept the payroll from the Mormon battalion in order to consecrate it to the Church. | |claim=The author claims that John D. Lee was sent by Brigham to intercept the payroll from the Mormon battalion in order to consecrate it to the Church. | ||
| − | | | + | }} |
| + | {{propaganda|This puts an ominous spin on something benign. Members joined the Mormon battalion in part to provide needed funds for the Church and their families (most of whom remained with the church) to help with the migration west. According to the cited source: | ||
<blockquote> | <blockquote> | ||
On August 28, about dark, President Young visited John D. Lee in his tent. "I have a very dangerous but responsible mission for you to perform," he said. "I want you to to follow up the Mormon Batallion and be at Santa Fe when they receive their payment. Can you go?" "I am willing to do whatever I can to further the cause," Lee answered without hesitation. | On August 28, about dark, President Young visited John D. Lee in his tent. "I have a very dangerous but responsible mission for you to perform," he said. "I want you to to follow up the Mormon Batallion and be at Santa Fe when they receive their payment. Can you go?" "I am willing to do whatever I can to further the cause," Lee answered without hesitation. | ||
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It should be noted that there is no use of the words "intercept" or "consecrate it" anywhere in the chapter. | It should be noted that there is no use of the words "intercept" or "consecrate it" anywhere in the chapter. | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | Brooks, ''John Doyle Lee'', 95. | + | #Brooks, ''John Doyle Lee'', 95. |
}} | }} | ||
<!-- ====53==== | <!-- ====53==== | ||
| − | {{ | + | {{IndexClaimItemShort |
|claim=The author claims that Brigham "used the battalion earnings to purchase food to stock a store he owned, which he then sold back to his starving Saints at inflated prices." | |claim=The author claims that Brigham "used the battalion earnings to purchase food to stock a store he owned, which he then sold back to his starving Saints at inflated prices." | ||
*The author claims that one of the battalion members said that "Some of the women, being entirely destitute, desired their husband's share, and some cried for the want of it." | *The author claims that one of the battalion members said that "Some of the women, being entirely destitute, desired their husband's share, and some cried for the want of it." | ||
| − | | | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | |authorsources= | + | # |
| − | + | }} | |
| + | |authorsources=<br> | ||
| + | #No source provided. Possibly Lee in Henrie, 183. | ||
}} --> | }} --> | ||
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|title=American Massacre | |title=American Massacre | ||
|claim=The author claims that Brigham declared "his own death and resurrection." | |claim=The author claims that Brigham declared "his own death and resurrection." | ||
| − | | | + | }} |
| + | {{misinformation|On page 454 of ''Year of Decision: 1846'', DeVoto writes that Brigham Young fell into a trance, which took him to where Joseph and Hyrum were. "It is hard," he told the Saints next Sunday, "it is hard coming to life again. But I know that I went to the world of spirits but what I saw I know not, for the vision went away from me, as a dream which you lose when you awake." | ||
There is no mention of a declaration of "his own death and resurrection" anywhere in the chapter. Brigham is reporting a vision or spiritual experience with the deceased Joseph and Hyrum. At most, one might call it an "out of body experience"—Brigham is not claiming to have been "resurrected" in any sense used by Latter-day Saints. | There is no mention of a declaration of "his own death and resurrection" anywhere in the chapter. Brigham is reporting a vision or spiritual experience with the deceased Joseph and Hyrum. At most, one might call it an "out of body experience"—Brigham is not claiming to have been "resurrected" in any sense used by Latter-day Saints. | ||
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|title=American Massacre | |title=American Massacre | ||
|claim=The author claims that Brigham "overcame resistance" from the Council of the Twelve and "finalized his own ascendancy" in order to be "elevated to a deity." | |claim=The author claims that Brigham "overcame resistance" from the Council of the Twelve and "finalized his own ascendancy" in order to be "elevated to a deity." | ||
| − | | | + | }} |
| − | |authorsources= | + | {{disinformation|This claim is absurd: no LDS leader is thought of as "a deity." Brigham certainly was aware of his own shortcomings. |
| − | No source provided. | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| + | #No source provided. | ||
}} | }} | ||
* See: [[Blood_of_the_Prophets:_Brigham_Young_and_the_Massacre_at_Mountain_Meadows/Omissions/Total_submission_to_Brigham_Young#Brigham.27s_statements|Brigham Young on his own fallibility]] | * See: [[Blood_of_the_Prophets:_Brigham_Young_and_the_Massacre_at_Mountain_Meadows/Omissions/Total_submission_to_Brigham_Young#Brigham.27s_statements|Brigham Young on his own fallibility]] | ||
<!-- ====54==== | <!-- ====54==== | ||
| − | {{ | + | {{IndexClaimItemShort |
|claim={{AuthorQuote|Young broke the tedium by courting Indian women along the way. Having been "sealed" to two Sioux squaws before leaving winter Quarters, he attempted to persuade others he met to unite with him on the spiritual journey.}} | |claim={{AuthorQuote|Young broke the tedium by courting Indian women along the way. Having been "sealed" to two Sioux squaws before leaving winter Quarters, he attempted to persuade others he met to unite with him on the spiritual journey.}} | ||
| − | + | |authorsources=<br> | |
| − | |authorsources= | + | #No source provided. Possibly Werner, 220? |
| − | |||
}} --> | }} --> | ||
| − | == | + | ==Response to claim: 59 - The author claims that Brigham Young "gave an ominous warning to all who had come. From this point forward, anyone who refused to live the laws about to be set forth was free to leave"== |
| − | {{ | + | {{IndexClaimItemShort |
| + | |title=American Massacre | ||
|claim=The author claims that in Brigham's very first address to the Saints after arriving in the Salt Lake valley that he "gave an ominous warning to all who had come. From this point forward, anyone who refused to live the laws about to be set forth was free to leave." | |claim=The author claims that in Brigham's very first address to the Saints after arriving in the Salt Lake valley that he "gave an ominous warning to all who had come. From this point forward, anyone who refused to live the laws about to be set forth was free to leave." | ||
| − | | | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | + | #No source provided. | |
| − | + | }} | |
| − | + | {{propaganda| | |
| + | {{InternalContradiction|This contradicts what the author states on page 106, where she says that anyone that wanted to leave was "hunted down and killed"}} | ||
}} | }} | ||
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| − | {{ | + | {{IndexClaimItemShort |
|claim=The author claims that Brigham used a divining rod that once belonged to Oliver Cowdery to select the site for the Salt Lake Temple. | |claim=The author claims that Brigham used a divining rod that once belonged to Oliver Cowdery to select the site for the Salt Lake Temple. | ||
| − | | | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| + | # | ||
| + | }} | ||
*{{CrossRef:Abanes:One Nation|chapter=5|pages=89, 518n49}} | *{{CrossRef:Abanes:One Nation|chapter=5|pages=89, 518n49}} | ||
*{{Detail|One Nation Under Gods/Use of sources/Divining rods to Kimball and Young|l1=Divining rods to Kimball and Young?}} | *{{Detail|One Nation Under Gods/Use of sources/Divining rods to Kimball and Young|l1=Divining rods to Kimball and Young?}} | ||
| − | |authorsources= | + | |authorsources=<br> |
| − | + | #No source provided. Likely Quinn. | |
}} --> | }} --> | ||
{{endnotes sources}} | {{endnotes sources}} | ||
| − | |||
| − | + | ||
| + | <!-- PLEASE DO NOT REMOVE ANYTHING BELOW THIS LINE --> | ||
Latest revision as of 13:11, 13 April 2024
Response to claims made in "Chapter Four: Winter Quarters—Council Bluffs, 1846"
| Chapter 3 | A FAIR Analysis of: American Massacre: The Tragedy at Mountain Meadows, a work by author: Sally Denton
|
Chapter 5 |
Response to claims made in American Massacre: The Tragedy at Mountain Meadows, "Chapter Four: Winter Quarters—Council Bluffs, 1846"
Jump to details:
- Response to claim: 42 - The author blames Col. Thomas Kane for helping to cover up the Massacre
- Response to claim: 53 - The author claims that John D. Lee was sent by Brigham to intercept the payroll from the Mormon battalion in order to consecrate it to the Church
- Response to claim: 54 - he author claims that Brigham declared "his own death and resurrection"
- Response to claim: 55 - The author claims that Brigham "overcame resistance" from the Council of the Twelve and "finalized his own ascendancy" in order to be "elevated to a deity"
- Response to claim: 59 - The author claims that Brigham Young "gave an ominous warning to all who had come. From this point forward, anyone who refused to live the laws about to be set forth was free to leave"
Response to claim: 42 - The author blames Col. Thomas Kane for helping to cover up the Massacre
The author(s) of American Massacre make(s) the following claim:
The author blames Col. Thomas Kane for helping to cover up the Massacre.Author's sources:
FAIR's Response
Fact checking results: This claim contains propaganda - The author, or the author's source, is providing information or ideas in a slanted way in order to instill a particular attitude or response in the reader
This claim by the author is nonsense.
Others often discussed in conjunction with the Mountain Meadows Massacre
Jump to details:
Response to claim: 53 - The author claims that John D. Lee was sent by Brigham to intercept the payroll from the Mormon battalion in order to consecrate it to the Church
The author(s) of American Massacre make(s) the following claim:
The author claims that John D. Lee was sent by Brigham to intercept the payroll from the Mormon battalion in order to consecrate it to the Church.
FAIR's Response
Fact checking results: This claim contains propaganda - The author, or the author's source, is providing information or ideas in a slanted way in order to instill a particular attitude or response in the reader
This puts an ominous spin on something benign. Members joined the Mormon battalion in part to provide needed funds for the Church and their families (most of whom remained with the church) to help with the migration west. According to the cited source:On August 28, about dark, President Young visited John D. Lee in his tent. "I have a very dangerous but responsible mission for you to perform," he said. "I want you to to follow up the Mormon Batallion and be at Santa Fe when they receive their payment. Can you go?" "I am willing to do whatever I can to further the cause," Lee answered without hesitation. . . . "Go, and God will protect you," Brother Brigham said, laying a firm hand on his shoulder. "I shall see that your families do not want. It is most important that we have what money we can get if we are to have food to survive this winter. Even then I have a heavy heart when I think of what is ahead.."
Then Lee accepted one of the most important assignments of his career.
It should be noted that there is no use of the words "intercept" or "consecrate it" anywhere in the chapter.
Response to claim: 54 - he author claims that Brigham declared "his own death and resurrection"
The author(s) of American Massacre make(s) the following claim:
The author claims that Brigham declared "his own death and resurrection."
FAIR's Response
Fact checking results: The author has stated erroneous information or misinterpreted their sources
On page 454 of Year of Decision: 1846, DeVoto writes that Brigham Young fell into a trance, which took him to where Joseph and Hyrum were. "It is hard," he told the Saints next Sunday, "it is hard coming to life again. But I know that I went to the world of spirits but what I saw I know not, for the vision went away from me, as a dream which you lose when you awake."There is no mention of a declaration of "his own death and resurrection" anywhere in the chapter. Brigham is reporting a vision or spiritual experience with the deceased Joseph and Hyrum. At most, one might call it an "out of body experience"—Brigham is not claiming to have been "resurrected" in any sense used by Latter-day Saints.
Response to claim: 55 - The author claims that Brigham "overcame resistance" from the Council of the Twelve and "finalized his own ascendancy" in order to be "elevated to a deity"
The author(s) of American Massacre make(s) the following claim:
The author claims that Brigham "overcame resistance" from the Council of the Twelve and "finalized his own ascendancy" in order to be "elevated to a deity."
FAIR's Response
Fact checking results: This claim is false
This claim is absurd: no LDS leader is thought of as "a deity." Brigham certainly was aware of his own shortcomings.
Response to claim: 59 - The author claims that Brigham Young "gave an ominous warning to all who had come. From this point forward, anyone who refused to live the laws about to be set forth was free to leave"
The author(s) of American Massacre make(s) the following claim:
The author claims that in Brigham's very first address to the Saints after arriving in the Salt Lake valley that he "gave an ominous warning to all who had come. From this point forward, anyone who refused to live the laws about to be set forth was free to leave."Author's sources:
- No source provided.
FAIR's Response
Fact checking results: This claim contains propaganda - The author, or the author's source, is providing information or ideas in a slanted way in order to instill a particular attitude or response in the reader
Internal contradiction: This contradicts what the author states on page 106, where she says that anyone that wanted to leave was "hunted down and killed"
Notes