Mormonism and politics/Economics of LDS immigration - Revision history

GregSmith at 19:23, 1 May 2024

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RogerNicholson at 23:14, 25 June 2017

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RogerNicholson at 23:14, 25 June 2017

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RogerNicholson: Redirected page to Question: Did early Mormon missionaries to England take advantage of "intolerable social and economic conditions" in order to gain converts?

2017-04-11T01:37:03Z

Redirected page to Question: Did early Mormon missionaries to England take advantage of "intolerable social and economic conditions" in order to gain converts?

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	~~{{Resource Title\|Did Latter-day Saint missionaries to England exploit the poverty of potential members?}}~~
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	~~{{:~~Question: Did early Mormon missionaries to England take advantage of "intolerable social and economic conditions" in order to gain converts?}}
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	~~[[fr:Economics of LDS immigration~~]]

RogerNicholson at 14:48, 28 March 2015

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	{{Resource Title\|Did Latter-day Saint missionaries to England exploit the poverty of potential members?}}		{{Resource Title\|Did Latter-day Saint missionaries to England exploit the poverty of potential members?}}
	== ==		== ==
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			{{:Question: Did early Mormon missionaries to England take advantage of "intolerable social and economic conditions" in order to gain converts?}}
	Did early Mormon missionaries to England take advantage of "intolerable social and economic conditions" in order to gain converts?		</onlyinclude>

	{{CriticalSources}}		{{CriticalSources}}
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	~~== ==~~
	{{~~Conclusion label~~}}

	Some immigrants doubtless were attracted by opportunities in America. But, significant financial hardships were required even to immigrate. Some Latter-day Saints (e.g., John Benbow) left considerable property and very comfortable circumstances in England. As is typical, Brodie oversimplifies a complex issue, and it is not surprising that the effect is to make church missionaries look exploitative. She apparently wishes to down play the spiritual attraction of the message preached by LDS missionaries.

	~~== ==~~
	~~{{Response label}}~~

	This claim was originally made by critic Fawn Brodie in her book ''No Man Knows My History: The Life of Joseph Smith ''. Brodie's claim oversimplifies a great deal. Charles Dickens described LDS immigrants as "the pick and flower of England." Immigration was also not a matter of instant financial benefits.

	~~For example, on the ship ''Amazon'' which sailed in 1863~~

	:"of prime importance in determining when a family would emigrate was the matter of finances. In spite of great faith, many would-be emigrants found it difficult to save enough money to pay for their passage and other expenses. Charles and Eliza West joined the Church in 1849 and began in 1853 to put money into the individual emigrating accounts kept by local Church leaders. But the expenses of a growing family made saving difficult....Half the married adults aboard the Amazon had been Latter-day Saints for thirteen years or more. Even those with a larger income found it difficult to save for emigration. But single adults, without the expense of a family, generally emigrated three to four years sooner after baptism than married adults. Though some of the Amazon passengers were recent converts, eighty-five percent of the adults had been members more than five years before they emigrated....Some husbands and fathers of Amazon passengers had emigrated earlier, hoping to establish a home in Utah and earn enough to pay for their families’ emigration. This was not an uncommon practice among emigrants. On the other hand, some wives—even expectant mothers—and children aboard the Amazon were leaving their husbands and fathers behind; these breadwinners hoped to join their families the next year after earning the rest of the emigration money and closing out their financial affairs." <ref>{{Ensign1\|author=Richard L. Jensen and Gordon Irving\|article=The Voyage of the ''Amazon'': A Close View of One Immigrant Company\|date=Mar 1980\|start=16}} {{link\|url=https://www.lds.org/ensign/1980/03/the-voyage-of-the-amazon-a-close-view-of-one-immigrant-company?lang=eng}}</ref>

	~~== ==~~
	~~{{Endnotes label}}~~

	~~<references/>~~

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	[[fr:Economics of LDS immigration]]		[[fr:Economics of LDS immigration]]

RogerNicholson: m

2014-06-09T20:00:04Z

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	For example, on the ship ''Amazon'' which sailed in 1863		For example, on the ship ''Amazon'' which sailed in 1863

	:"of prime importance in determining when a family would emigrate was the matter of finances. In spite of great faith, many would-be emigrants found it difficult to save enough money to pay for their passage and other expenses. Charles and Eliza West joined the Church in 1849 and began in 1853 to put money into the individual emigrating accounts kept by local Church leaders. But the expenses of a growing family made saving difficult....Half the married adults aboard the Amazon had been Latter-day Saints for thirteen years or more. Even those with a larger income found it difficult to save for emigration. But single adults, without the expense of a family, generally emigrated three to four years sooner after baptism than married adults. Though some of the Amazon passengers were recent converts, eighty-five percent of the adults had been members more than five years before they emigrated....Some husbands and fathers of Amazon passengers had emigrated earlier, hoping to establish a home in Utah and earn enough to pay for their families’ emigration. This was not an uncommon practice among emigrants. On the other hand, some wives—even expectant mothers—and children aboard the Amazon were leaving their husbands and fathers behind; these breadwinners hoped to join their families the next year after earning the rest of the emigration money and closing out their financial affairs."{{~~ref~~\|~~capitalize~~.1}}		:"of prime importance in determining when a family would emigrate was the matter of finances. In spite of great faith, many would-be emigrants found it difficult to save enough money to pay for their passage and other expenses. Charles and Eliza West joined the Church in 1849 and began in 1853 to put money into the individual emigrating accounts kept by local Church leaders. But the expenses of a growing family made saving difficult....Half the married adults aboard the Amazon had been Latter-day Saints for thirteen years or more. Even those with a larger income found it difficult to save for emigration. But single adults, without the expense of a family, generally emigrated three to four years sooner after baptism than married adults. Though some of the Amazon passengers were recent converts, eighty-five percent of the adults had been members more than five years before they emigrated....Some husbands and fathers of Amazon passengers had emigrated earlier, hoping to establish a home in Utah and earn enough to pay for their families’ emigration. This was not an uncommon practice among emigrants. On the other hand, some wives—even expectant mothers—and children aboard the Amazon were leaving their husbands and fathers behind; these breadwinners hoped to join their families the next year after earning the rest of the emigration money and closing out their financial affairs." <ref>{{Ensign1\|author=Richard L. Jensen and Gordon Irving\|article=The Voyage of the ''Amazon'': A Close View of One Immigrant Company\|date=Mar 1980\|start=16}} {{link\|url=https://www.lds.org/ensign/1980/03/the-voyage-of-the-amazon-a-close-view-of-one-immigrant-company?lang=eng}}</ref>

			== ==
			{{Endnotes label}}

			<references/>

	~~=={{Endnotes label}}==~~
	#{{note\|capitalize.1}} {{Ensign1\|author=Richard L. Jensen and Gordon Irving\|article=The Voyage of the ''Amazon'': A Close View of One Immigrant Company\|date=Mar 1980\|start=16}} {{link\|url=http://www.lds.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?hideNav=1&locale=0&sourceId=5b04615b01a6b010VgnVCM1000004d82620a____&vgnextoid=2354fccf2b7db010VgnVCM1000004d82620aRCRD}}
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	[[fr:Economics of LDS immigration]]		[[fr:Economics of LDS immigration]]

RogerNicholson: /* */ m

2013-12-26T01:52:31Z

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	This claim was originally made by critic Fawn Brodie in her book ''No Man Knows My History: The Life of Joseph Smith ''. . Brodie's claim oversimplifies a great deal. Charles Dickens described LDS immigrants as "the pick and flower of England." Immigration was also not a matter of instant financial benefits.		This claim was originally made by critic Fawn Brodie in her book ''No Man Knows My History: The Life of Joseph Smith ''. Brodie's claim oversimplifies a great deal. Charles Dickens described LDS immigrants as "the pick and flower of England." Immigration was also not a matter of instant financial benefits.

	For example, on the ship ''Amazon'' which sailed in 1863		For example, on the ship ''Amazon'' which sailed in 1863

RogerNicholson: /* */ m

2013-12-26T01:52:10Z

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	This claim is made by critic Fawn Brodie. Brodie's claim oversimplifies a great deal. Charles Dickens described LDS immigrants as "the pick and flower of England." Immigration was also not a matter of instant financial benefits.		This claim was originally made by critic Fawn Brodie in her book ''No Man Knows My History: The Life of Joseph Smith ''. . Brodie's claim oversimplifies a great deal. Charles Dickens described LDS immigrants as "the pick and flower of England." Immigration was also not a matter of instant financial benefits.

	For example, on the ship ''Amazon'' which sailed in 1863		For example, on the ship ''Amazon'' which sailed in 1863